In defense of He Kexin, sort of
Mark Sappenfield | 08.22.08
There is a part of me that feels that my Olympics would have been diminished had He Kexin not been here.
This is not to condone cheating. If she and several of her teammates are under age 16, as several Western media reports suggest, she should not have competed. Further reports that the international gymnastics federation (FIG) will investigate are welcome.
That said, He’s uneven bar routine was the single most breathtaking thing I saw during the Olympic gymnastics program.
I say this not to begin a debate about who performed the best routine in nine days of gymnastics, but to point out that in the Olympics – a competition devoted to continually redefining the frontiers of human performance – He is a Louis and Clark of the uneven bars.
It is clear that she could do what she did only because she is so small. For all her talent, 18-year-old American Nastia Liukin could not have done some of the releases and hand holds that He did. At 5-foot-3, 99 lbs., she is simply too big.
So we return to one of gymnastics’ eternal questions: How young is too young to be a professional athlete, which these girls basically are?
The arguments on both sides can be compelling.
The most obvious argument against the FIG’s prohibition on Olympic competition for anyone under 16 is that, had the law been in force in 1976, we never would have known Nadia Comenici. In a sport built on flexibility and the ability to defy gravity, an age limit can prevent gymnasts from competing at the height of their abilities.
The counterargument that the sort of intense training needed to compete internationally is unhealthy for someone so young. A body that is still growing, critics say, cannot cope with such stress, leading to physical problems.
The momentum seems to favoring the counterargument at the moment. The head of FIG has talked of expanding the 16-year-old age limit to all international competitions – not just the Olympics. According to such a law, American Shawn Johnson would not have been the world all-around champion last year. She was 15.
Putting aside the question of whether this gives authoritarian countries a competitive advantage – since they can more easily alter birth data – there seems to be some sense in this. Sporting federations exist not only to promote the sport, but to protect the athletes – from themselves or those who would use them.
Yet I am glad I had the chance to see He Kexin all the same, no matter what her age.
<< The alternate universe of the Olympics | MainComments
2. Ed Crowley | 08.22.08
You are missing the point. The USA and other countrys have wonderful gymnasts that are 14 years old. These are amazing athletes. The point is its not fair that they could not participate but the Chinnese can.
3. Melvin | 08.22.08
If rules of any kind are not to be enforced because ones performance was breathtaking then why have the rules in the first place?
There are in the world multitudes of Olympic worthy athletes who could produce breathtaking athletic performances but could not compete because they were not old enough and they chose to follow the rules set forth by the IOC.
This isn’t rocket science people Miss Kexin is either 16 years of age or she isn’t period. Either enforce Olympic rules or do not, there is no gray area.
But the gray area around Miss Kexin’s age is just as dark and uncertain as the gray dirty air that swirls around Beijing, neither will ever be clear.
5. JohnM | 08.22.08
Ed Crowley made the point that struck me too; If China sent kids under 16 then all countries should have been able to. Just imagine the under 16s we didn’t get to see from around the world. Perhaps if size makes such a huge difference in what these athletes can physically execute, perhaps the IOC and FIG need to consider creating classes of competition based on the athletes’ size the same way we do with judo, wrestling, and other sports.
6. SP | 08.22.08
Asian gymnist from the past has always been smaller and look younger than the average person or compared to their competitors but that was never an issue. Why now? Do people even care to realize that the Japanese gymnastics team are almost as small as these Chinese?
Yes, I do believe biased opinions in sports can’t be helped but I also believe that all gymnastics gymnists/team should be judged based on their talents, ability and determination and each should be receice the outmost respect from the Olympics and its viewers disregarding any type of prejudice or speculated allegations. What upsets me is how this so called ‘issue’ seem so judgemental and are over-scrutinized by the media and by ignorant people. It’s really sad because most of the comments regarding the Chinese gymnastic team are said without conscience, consideration, disrespect, and unprofessional manner.
The Olympics is to unite the world of sports and to acknowledge accomplisments whether or not a medal are received or awarded and I just can’t help but realize the inconsideration against the Chinese gymnastic team. It is truly unfortunate because the hardwork, dedication, teamwork, talents, and abilities of these young girls are overshadowed by unproven allegations, scrutiny, and disrespect. It’s not about ‘rules are rules’ anymore but racial discrimination and demeaning (a country’s) spormanship.
7. wiseman20a22 | 08.22.08
Nah….It’s “allegation” hyped up mainly by American media. Americans want that piece of gold so bad they would probably do anything to strip the gold off from that little girl. I myself am a 30 something Asian and am always asked for ID when I buy alcohol in the States. My other Asian friends also encountered the same problem all the time. I mean ALL THE TIME. Simply put Westerns in general have great difficulty identifying Asian people’s age by looking at us. Asians also have great difficulty identifying Caucasian or black people’s age. Most of Caucasian teens look like late-20-something to our eyes. No kidding!
It’s time go grab more golds by American athletes, not by jingoistic American journalists. LOL
8. Mitch | 08.22.08
First of all, the Chinese, Romanians and others have admitted to using younger aged girls. In fact, a chinese gymnast in 2004 admitted to being too young for the competition. I am just curious where their birth certificates are? He, who won a gold, has not been known in the international seen for a while. Is it because she is 16 and just now came into being a good gymnast, or is it because she isn’t old enough. I have always said I would gladly lose to someone better as long as it is fair. It’s not just the viewers and Americans crying fowl. Coaches and other countries are too. If the IOC truly believed that she is 16, then why then investigation. It’s disappointing to their country, to He, and to the rest of the gymnasts. If it were an American gymnast under the same scrutiny, I would feel the same way.
9. scott | 08.22.08
The Chinese cheated, He is the vehicle they used. I think the rules are stupid because the age limit for competition doesn’t protect these girls from anything, injuries occur through the training as much or more than in competition. Everybody shout’s rules are rules but that’s stupid too, protest the rules. I applaud the Chinese for cheating and bringing up the debate. And like the writer said, we got to see these girls perform.
10. steph | 08.22.08
Come on now. Cheng Fei LOOKS 20. She in no way looks under 16. He Kexin and especially Deng Linlin LOOK extremely young. No bones about it.
Medals get stripped from athletes in other sports for other rule breaking issues. why is this any different? because she’s a “cute little girl?” so we should not remove medals from “cute track and field girls” because they used drugs? China knew what it was getting itself into if they used these very young looking girls in the highest profile sport in the entire olympics. So if they are found to NOT be under 16…great. more power to them! keep those medals. if they are under 16, it’s the Chinese coaches who should be chastised. Just like it’s the track and field coaches who should be chastisted for giving their runners an illegal pill and the runner didn’t know it. the runner’s medal still gets stripped. them’s the breaks.
steph
11. Jon | 08.22.08
Truth is He Kexin is propably a victim in this whole thing as well. She obviously didn’t forge her passport. Her parents, coaches and govt are to blame for this. They are the ones behind this whole mess. Should she lose her medals? Yes, If this turns out to be true then action needs to be taken. As far as the age issue goes….I think it should stay 15 or 16 within the same year of the Olympics. Although maybe the IOC should consider some sort excemption policy for athletes in certain events. For instance won a particular event/championship with a year of the Olypics. Im sure they have some sort of International competition every year thats bigger than others. Anyways…the bottom line is that rules are in place and other countries are following them. Switch the roles here…what if the United States were in the chinese shoes right now and vice versa…do you think the chinese would react the same or differently?
12. Melvin | 08.22.08
If the international community is to turn a blind eye to those countries that allow athletes who are underage regardless of the type of sport involved to compete, then also allow those athletes who use performance enhancing substances to compete as well.
Same rational right?
14. Jon | 08.22.08
Even China’s own Yang Yun, a double bronze medalist in Sydney, said during an interview aired on state broadcaster China Central Television that she was 14 during the 2000 Games.
http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/summer08/gymnastics/news/story?id=3547713
15. wiseman20a22 | 08.22.08
No matter how American jounalists try to stir up **** and put pressure on the IOC or try to rank its own medal counts in all sort of strange ways, America is not going to dominate gold medals anymore. Just wake up and smell the coffee. LOL
16. Jon | 08.22.08
wiseman20a22:
“I myself am a 30 something Asian and am always asked for ID when I buy alcohol in the States.”
Im not sure if that proves anything at all considering thats a law in the United States. Im a 30yr old white male and I get carded all the time…
17. cary | 08.22.08
The best should compete regardless of their age. The idea is to award the best. Why don’t we institute a rule that you must be over 40 years old to run in the 100 meters. Then older guys like me would have a chance. We shouldn’t allow the young runners. They have an unfair advantage because they can move their legs faster!
18. wiseman20a22 | 08.22.08
“Im not sure if that proves anything at all considering thats a law in the United States. Im a 30yr old white male and I get carded all the time…”
it’s fact that Caucasians look a lot more mature than Asians at the same age. When your eyes are untrained, you just can’t tell. White people have misidentified my age all the time all kinds of situations. Same things happen to my other Asian friends. Coincident? I don’t think so.
And you can look into that Japanese girl competed in the last event of gymnastics - individual balance beam. She was extremely small built and very young looking too. How come no American media questioned her age? Well…because she was not competing against American team head-to-head.
19. john | 08.22.08
Those girls were recruited in 2001 when China was awarded the olympic 2008 hosting right. They were 9 years old girls picked from local sporting schools and then trained for the next 7 years especially for the 2008 olympics. China made the plan in 2001. Americans just don’t get pass the fact that those girls really ARE 16 years old. Of course they will feel very offended people keep accusing them of cheating. Those so called media report spell the wrong age just a result of some lazy reporters, report false information without checking with the sport authority. It happens all the right. 2 news reported the wrong age, while hundreds more reported the right age.
20. Jon | 08.22.08
wiseman20a22
How exactly do I train myself to be able to identify someones age? And as far as the American media thing goes I think that is a bit a stretch. It’s easy for you to blame them and say it’s because we are not competing against them cause thats your only argument. That’s the medias job and its not just the American media reporting this.
21. Melvin | 08.22.08
For those that are posting that the age question is only directed at Asians, ppplllleeeaasssee spare the sanctimonious rhetoric. It is not a question of being Asian or being or Americans dominating in the medal count, it is simply a question of alleged cheating. Cheating people not nationality or ethnicity.
Besides, if the Olympics has gotten to the point that only medal count is important, then the Olympics has lost its purpose.
May be it is time for the Olympics to go the way of the dinosaur. This event has became too expensive, too political, and has ceased to function as it was intended to.
22. red blooded american | 08.22.08
1) The American girls team was terrible in the team finals.
2) He Kexin was absolutely awesome, and may look like a toddler, but carried herself with grace and class in front of billions of tv watchers.
3) If we cant beat Chinese gymnast in diapers, then we didnt deserve the gold medal.
4) Lukin isnt even American, she is Russian. And her arrogrance, and snotty attitude showed it.
5) Congratulations, He Kexin, you deserved the gold, even if you look like you need a warm bottle of milk, and a bedtime story.
Nuff said,
23. Jon | 08.22.08
“It is not a question of being Asian or being or Americans dominating in the medal count, it is simply a question of alleged cheating”
and thats just it………
24. Chuck Staples | 08.22.08
I think the competitor from Japan comes from a country without authoritarian rule, “sports academies”, and a transparent system of documenting births and identities. Sure, she may look young to western eyes, but the passport is more believable. Seriously, when was the last time an athlete from a democratic society was proven to be under age in an international competition?
If He and the others are indeed too young, they must bear the burden of a lie their entire lives. Their government took two years away from them if the allegations are proven valid. The Chinese government was quoted as saying “do you believe everything you read on the Internet” (which I find very ironic). But results from three consecutive years of results showing He’s age being two years younger than what her new passport indicates seems like a highly sloppy system at best. They don’t have age bracket competition in China?
Why are the parents indignant? Just pull out your kids’ birth certificates… Pretty simple exercise for anyone else. The burden of proof should be on the athlete - it is for every other athlete to show their real age.
25. Alex | 08.22.08
There is nothing compelling about being a lier. He Kexin is a lier now and she will become even worse when she grows up. She is a bad example for other girls.
Nastia Liukin was 15 during the last Olympics and was not allowed to compete even though she had medal chances back than, too. Shawn Johnson is barely 16 now, and, yes, when she was 15 she was also pretty amazing. As we know, ’cause she happened to win the Worlds. But if she hadn’t turned 16 this year, the American federation would have never let her compete. This is about giving everyone equal chances and about making rules apply to everyone, even to the most amazing of all children.
Nastia was never arrogant, she said that Kexin is an amazing athlete regardless of her age. But this is not about being amazing. The girl from Vietnam who was caught with doping and qualified 58th was still disqualified because you just don’t do certain things. And whether you place first or last should never matter.
26. wiseman20a22 | 08.22.08
it’s not the first America calling other cheaters whereas America has its own Marion Jones.
27. Chuck Staples | 08.22.08
Yup, and she’s spending time in prison for her doping lies. We vetted ourselves out and continue to do so as much as is possible.
But Marion Jones was still old enough.
28. Ed Crowley | 08.22.08
Marion Jones is a cheater and here in the USA we admit cheating and punish cheaters. Marion Jones is currently in jail because she lied about cheating.
30. wiseman20a22 | 08.22.08
“Yup, and she’s spending time in prison for her doping lies. We vetted ourselves out and continue to do so as much as is possible.”
No kidding…long after she enjoyed her glory and American corporations ripped huge profits from promoting her. LOL
Oh puuuuleeezz! dont equate doping to the underage thing. It’s not the same. And the underage thing is still allegation only.
31. LX | 08.22.08
Citing past Chinese gymnastics admitting they were under 16 when they competed doesn’t prove anything. This age limit is a quite new rule as far as I know.
32. wiseman20a22 | 08.22.08
“wiseman20a22: Are you an American citizen?”
Nope…And don’t even live in America. What? Should I get shot by treason? LOL
33. Alex | 08.22.08
QUOTE: No kidding…long after she enjoyed her glory and American corporations ripped huge profits from promoting her. LOL”
Oh, no, we are not kidding. Nobody is preventing CORPORATIONS from investing in He Kexin. They can make her the next top model if they want. But the one thing is: she should not have an Olympic gold. When you cheat, you don’t get a medal. It is as simple as that.
Now if someone wants to shoot you in a cereal commercial, it is their own choice and their own bet. A number of people who never won anything get profits from advertising, so why not a Chinese gymnast? When she turns 16, she can give it another try with everyone else.
34. Jon | 08.22.08
Thats funny cause you mention that you get carded all the time trying to buy alcohol…just wondering is that in the UK….
35. Cynthia | 08.22.08
wiseman20a22 is correct. I’m Filipino-American. When my car–parked outside my parents’ home in central Iowa–was crushed by large truck, the investigating officer didn’t ask me for my ID–he questioned whether I was old enough to be driving. It has a hurtful accusation based on an ignorant assumption–I had a valid license and wasn’t at fault in the accident. It is difficult to tell how old a person is. We have to rely on the gymnasts’ published ages–there’s enough discrepancy there to warrant an investigation.
36. Alex | 08.22.08
No, in the US, you get carded until you start having white hair. I am 27 and get carded every single time. My friends who are in their late 30s also do,
37. ian | 08.22.08
Kexin put in a breathtaking performance; there’s no doubt about that. But rules are rules. Just like the bizarre tiebreaking rule which Liukin had to accept. We can debate whether these rules are fair, but that’s not the issue here. Without rules competition becomes meaningless.
In the case of He Kexin, the allegations stem not from merely her prepubescent look but are based on official documents (which have somehow been removed and/or altered, imagine that!) No need to bring up the tired old “Asians look younger than their age” garbage here. I am Asian myself. I’ve heard that line so many times, it’s not even funny.
38. Alex | 08.22.08
the investigating officer didn’t ask me for my ID–he questioned whether I was old enough to be driving.
So when you showed him the ID, did he leave you alone? 
And is your ID fake like He Kexin’s?
39. Alex | 08.22.08
Come on, all of these gymnasts look very young, not just the Asians. Honestly, Shawn Johnson doesn’t look 16. That Russian girl Ksenia,she is sooo tiny, too.That’s why we have these things called passports and birth certificates. To sort out the subjectivity.
40. Mike | 08.22.08
OKAY hold up a second.
These are all ALLEGATIONS… If she cheated she cheated, if she didnt she didnte. Not much we can do sitting behind a monitor to prove it either way. I am sure the FIG and the IOC have some people investigating the allegations.
Yes He does look young, but **** all asian people look young until they are in the later years, I know this from experience of living in many asian countries and having a Chinese wife.
I will admit her small frame and immature looking face does throw some suspicion into it. If asked to provide the proper documents, I am sure they can produce whatever is needed to prove her age. With that said, we will have to take whatever it is at face value.
I would like to think that the host nation would not do something as bold as to out right cheat on such a big stage. China is trying to open its doors to the rest of the world and show they are not the same country they were 10+ years ago, this would certainly take away from what they have built up to.
I do not care who got gold, silver or bronze, What I was glad to see was athletes going out and putting on one heck of a show for the people of the world, and when it was all said and done they hugged and gave the kisses to the cheeks of other competitors like they should. These athletes performed their hearts out. Lets just take it at that and let the governing bodies figure out if it was within the rules or not.
41. Mike | 08.22.08
I do not know who keeps saying He Kexin’s performance was breathtaking, but it was not all that. I feel that the American girl (not going to attempt to spell her name) had a far better performance. Though some judges *cough* Australian *cough* decided it wasnt as good. The best way to do the judging for this is allow countries who have actually medaled int he event at some point in history judge. I mean heck why not just get a judge from ethiopia to judge. These judges receive minimal training and some of them could care less about who wins.
42. lenovo | 08.22.08
hey, who faked reports of WMDs for their own end?? was it.. our american government? hmm.
Glad i finally left the U.S.
43. Melvin | 08.22.08
Remember back especially women if they were carded or being informed that they looked younger it was considered a compliment.
My Asian wife of twenty-five years was hit upon by a ninteen year old last year. I wasn’t upset, being a younger man I suppose I would have, but being older I just told her, “Damn girl you’ve still got it.” She just smiled with a twinkle in her eye and an extra spring in her step and said, “Yep.”
44. Alex | 08.22.08
There are ways to track birth records and passports. If their own Chinese newspapers have interviews with the girls citing a different age, why not inquire into whether they were lying then or they are lying now? That way, we would not have speculate about who looks a certain way, who is missing teeth etc. because, yes, doing that is plain silly. This stuff can be seen black on white and it should be because fairness demands it.
The fact that the website of their own government agency had different birthdates for them is very suspicious, to say the least. I can’t say that they cheated for sure but these are some pretty strong signs. It’s not like the Americans published these records. If anyhting, the Chinese should be eager to have this investigation and see their own names clean. If they are clean, that is.
45. Mike | 08.22.08
I love when people come hit on my wife, it makes me feel good and also she starts speaking to them in Mandarin, they get this confused and defeated look on their face and walk away, her and I laugh about it later.
46. Bonnie | 08.22.08
It does not matter that the Japanese gymnasts were ‘just as small’ as the Chiense gymnasts - because the Japanese gymnasts were of the appropriate age (per the rules) to compete.
My daughters are Chinese. My younger duaghetr, who is turnign 8, is often mistaken for 4 or 5 year sold. People think ’she is so smart’ because she looks 4 or 5 — I tell them she is almost 8, as does she. It owudl be WRONG of us to allow her to receive kudos for being ’so smart’ because she appeasr younger; it would be WRONG of me to enter her into a contest for children under age 6, knowing she would kick their butts because she is OLDER.
If He KeXin is indeed NOT of the age required to compete, it is WRONG for her to have been entered and, utlimately, to keep her medals.
My daughters and their friends, all also born in China, sat together watching the Olympics the night of the gymnastic team competition. Without exception, the 8 girls thoguth the Chinese team was extraordincarily beautiful and talented, but also without exception, they all said “no way are they all 15 and up”.
When we watched the vault finals and saw Cheng Fen fall and still receive a medal, we all flipped out! And the North Korean girl who also faltered and ’stole’ the medal from the Russian/German woman (who was PERFECT) was a night of incredulity!
Between the age scandal, the lip-synching/child-swap at Opening Ceremonies, and the digital insertion of fireworks, what my children took away from the Olympics about their birth country is ‘win at all costs, regardless of what is right’ ……. is that really what China wants people to think?
Yes, He KeXin’s official papers say she is 16 this year .. .well who provided the official papers? Oh yes, the government that digitally inserted fireworks and swapped a child songster, and who by the way also provided ‘official’ paperwork for my children and their friends - all of which was fabricated …..
So WISEMAN20a22, don’t go getting so holier than thou on us …. it’s all a bunch of propaganda and you’re just ticked off that China is being called on the carpet for it … embarassing for China, yes - and it should be … it reminds me of the Soviet bloc judges in earlier Olympics giving perfect scores to anyone from a communist country and giving 4s and 5s to western athletes … bias isn’t just something from which white people suffer.
47. ian | 08.22.08
The issue here is NOT, I repeat, NOT about some Australian judge, or about Liukin’s performance (which, BTW, was also breathtaking IMO.)
The issue is whether or not the Chinese government LIED about He Kexin’s age and tried to cover up their tracks.
48. Melvin | 08.22.08
Bonnie called it, a tween or a teen can ferret out another teenager in a heart beat with 100% accuracy.
49. Jon | 08.22.08
lenovo
“hey, who faked reports of WMDs for their own end?? was it.. our american government? hmm. ”
“Glad i finally left the U.S.”
what does that have to do with the Olympics…Im glad you left the U.S. as well..
50. Alex | 08.22.08
I agree with you, Bonnie, on the vault finals! Very well said. And the Russian/German gymnast who you are referring to is 33. She trains in Germany becaus her son has leukimia and Germany has one of the best clinics in the world for his treatment. She has been by far the best vaulter since the 1990s and continued after she gave birth! And she did stick her landings.
Enough injustice has been inflicted during this Olympics. If any gymnast is below 16, they should be disqualified, stay healthy and in shape, and come back in 2012.
51. Jon | 08.22.08
WISEMAN20a22
“I myself am a 30 something Asian and am always asked for ID when I buy alcohol in the States. My other Asian friends also encountered the same problem all the time. I mean ALL THE TIME.”
And you don’t live in the states…must come here on a lot of business trips……
52. Jane | 08.22.08
Whatever happened to the junior olympics, which is the venue that used to be used for younger athletes? This isn’t good enough for younger athletes? Sorry but there are always ‘dues’ to be paid and this is true in everything. The older girls that are of age and should be there are looking at very finite careers in competing in their sport for their countries and age DOES MATTER! Those girls, all of them, from all countries, have obviously invested a huge amount of time and dollars in their training as well and should be allowed to compete in a FAIR field, and not have to compete against children. Those children should be competing with others that are their age and their time for going to the olympics should be when they are old enough. If they are good enough at 14 then they should definitely be good enough at 16 to compete in the regular olympics so whatever is trying to be proved by China if this ends up being true is beyond me. For them to be the host country and to take those kinds of chances puts a new definition to the term “egotistical”.
53. Margo | 08.22.08
“It is clear that she could do what she did only because she is so small. For all her talent, 18-year-old American Nastia Liukin could not have done some of the releases and hand holds that He did. At 5-foot-3, 99 lbs., she is simply too big.”
Dear Mr. Sappenfield, I think you need to a little research because it seems you have just jumped on the gymnastics band wagon. Svetlana Khorkina of Russia was a 3 time Olympian. She won gold on the uneven bars in 1996 and 2000 Olympic Games and other gold medals on bars won at the World Champoinships. She was 5′5″, which is tall for a gymnast. Have you ever seen her bar routines? You can probably find it on youtube. She has an element named after her called “the Khorkina” and it’s a release move. You can’t be “too big” and have an element named after you. See the difference in Shawn Johnson and Nastia Liukin, or Svetlana Khorkina and Mary Lou Retton, is body lines. Let’s not forget that this is Artistic Gymnastics. There is dance in the routines that provide grace and poise. Compartively, Nastia is a better twister and Shawn is a better flipper, however even Shawn and Mary Lou graceful. Most importantly, I don’t care how spectacular or difficult He’s bar routine is. Speaking of difficulty, there is no difference between Nastia and He. They both have a start value of 7.7, which is the highest value a routine have. But, He is not 16 and China knows it. American has it’s cheaters like Marion Jones, but Marion was eligible to compete. I certainly hope that if they find that her younger than 16, they revoke her medal and award the other gymnasts correctly.
54. Bonnie | 08.22.08
My kids and I felt sad for Alicia Sacrimoni (not medalling at all), but we were all hopping mad over the Russian/German woman — BOY! she is AWESOME!! And yes, we knew her backstory, which made her peformance so much sweeter to watch. She deserved the gold in vaulting …
By the time we got to watch women’s platform diving finals, my younger daughetr asked ‘who are we rooting for now Mom?’ and my elder replied ‘anyone except for China’ …. I told her that wasn;t right and that in this instance the Chinese woman was not only the right age but also the best … and pointed out to her that she shouldn’t be so angry with China; every country has flaws (of course she is still pretty darn angry that Americans re-elected “W”, so it’s hard for me to fault her logic) ….
But I realy think this whole age think has tarnished the events, and China, in a way that was completely avoidable …. making a big splash is what China wanted, and certainly so much of it was amazingly beautiful and a wonderful showcase, but so much of it simply was not - and I think it has put a light on aspects of China that should indeed raise questions in people’s minds - the people of China; it has been a long time since TianAnMen …. do not let fleeting prosperity turn your head from change ….
55. wiseman20a22 | 08.22.08
So WISEMAN20a22, don’t go getting so holier than thou on us …. it’s all a bunch of propaganda and you’re just ticked off that China is being called on the carpet for it … embarassing for China, yes - and it should be … it reminds me of the Soviet bloc judges in earlier Olympics giving perfect scores to anyone from a communist country and giving 4s and 5s to western athletes … bias isn’t just something from which white people suffer
====================
why should I get ticked off that China is being called this and that?…I am an Asian, but I am not Chinese….Doh…Anyway I am not going to waste my time with a bunch of cry babies…..
56. Jon | 08.22.08
What is going on here…this debate is simply over allegations of cheating. People are talking about race issues, WMDs, and our flaws of re-electing President George Bush. The story at hand is someones age and is that person deserving of the medal if allegations are proven to be true. If not than then its over. Either your on one side or another. It’s not that complicated.
57. Jon | 08.22.08
“why should I get ticked off that China is being called this and that?…I am an Asian, but I am not Chinese….Doh…Anyway I am not going to waste my time with a bunch of cry babies…..”
you were the one crying about getting carded all the time…the fact is that your comments are questionable and not making any sense at all…
58. kip | 08.22.08
I think we can’t conclude cheating yet? But this brings back another point I want to make. I have read yahoo and others commenting that, “China doesn’t need to cheat with the way judges are this year.” It is such an egocentric thinking. Just because China is earning the medals doesn’t mean the judges unfair. I think we should take the opportunity to congrat China working so hard (hiring better trainers, etc..) to get make their athletes better. The US has dominated for so long, no body was crying judges this and that, they (like China) tried to find ways to better themselves to compete. So i think we should quit talking BS and spend a little more if we want to win gold and congrat others for their hardwork. Yes, other countries actually can become better overtime.
59. Alex | 08.22.08
Oh, yes, people cried judges like **** when Hamm won in the last Olympics after he fell. Whenever there is injustice, it should be investigated, that’s all.
60. Bonnie | 08.22.08
I just think, that just like in the men’s races the other night where the silver and bronze medals were taken away because both athletes stepped over the line and the guys who were in 4th and 5th were awarded silver and bronze instead, IF the ages of the gymnasts were falsified, their medals should be taken away …. it is really pretty simple.
61. PrincessAldora | 08.22.08
well, its a fact dat Caucasians look older than Asians.. but He Kexin really looks very young.. Howeva, looks may be deceiving.. So juz dun judge a book by the cover OK?
China had put in tremendous effort in grooming its talents and also played its part in hosting the Olympic games.. Perhaps winning too many medals in its own territory may prove to be an eyesore to the many out dere *shrugs*
But seriously, i feel that the China ppl won graciously with their strength.. We can see their opponents being utterly crushed (can really see the huge gap between the strong and the strongest) in almost every match.. So even if they were to win the medals, they win it based on their wits n strength.. So dere’s nth to be sore abt.. In fact, i feel dat other countries shld learn to emulate China in training/grooming more talents dat can play well in the Olympics..
And its time for Asians to do themselves proud rite? US has taken enough medals.. And we’re really sick of listening to her anthem broadcasted over and over again at the victory ceremony.. Perhaps we should learn to adapt to the change?
Den again, if China blatantly flouted the rules, den she should face the consequences.. If not, den congrats to little Kexin in clinching the gold medal!
62. Myra Clark | 08.22.08
Things shouldn’t be easy or simple when questions like this come up. True resolution of this issue should include understanding the values of the countries involved, including the norms for accomplishing goals (how can we condemn others so completely given the U.S. doping scandals?). Resolution should affirm the work and talent of the gymnasts. How can it be said that “its that simple” to strip medals from these athletes? How simple is it to leave someone heartbroken and in pain, without the effort to understand the situation from everyone’s point of view? Does it hurt anyone to ask those questions and search for the answers? The results may be the same, but how the outcome is achieved matters. I do think that the posts show that people are looking for a way to frame the issue in a way that takes in the complexities. I hope we all keep working at it.
63. Riverfour | 08.22.08
No need to discuss this. Had US team won all the gymnastic golds, would there be any whining about this? Just a plain loser mind.
65. PrincessAldora | 08.22.08
In the first place.. WHY must there be competition?
Most competitions bring 2 results– win or lose..
The winner takes it all.. The loser feels crushed.. So the loser trains harder (or even via underhand means) so as to emerge as the next winner.. This cycle continues and soon human is trapped in this vicious cycle… So WHY compete in the first place when you know that you might not win? I simply can’t understand the logic of competing..
So we can’t blame the losers for feeling sore and to find reasons to justify their defeat.. And we can’t blame winners for cheating…
Ergo, we can only blame the callousness of competition in itself and the ugly side of human nature to take pride in winning =)
66. Alex | 08.22.08
It may be painful but they knew about the rules. There is no sport without rules and if you don’t follow them, you face the danger of losing your medal just like those runners did.
67. Chris | 08.22.08
Either she’s 16 or she isn’t. It has nothing to do with her ethnicity, her race, what country she’s from, how well she performed, etc. Either she’s 16 or she isn’t. If she isn’t, she should not be a champion. Period.
For those of you who think it’s an outcry from the American media simply because our gymnastics team did not win, you are wrong. Unfortunately, American athletes have cheated in the past and we have done what is right. Marion Jones is no longer an Olympic champion and is in jail. Floyd Landis is no longer the Tour de France champion after he was found guilty of doping. Bill Belichik of the New England Patriots was punished after it was discovered that he broke the rules of the NFL.
The point is, if there is sufficient evidence to warrant an investigation, then there should be one. It does not matter what country the athlete is from, whether they finished first or last, etc. If it is found that some of the Chinese gymnasts are under age, then their medals should be taken away.
Perhaps to quiet those that are saying, “It’s just because Americans are sore losers.”, we should not award the gold medals to anyone if the Chinese did break the rules. Let them go un-awarded in the 2008 Olympics to serve as reminder to the rest of the world that the spirit of the Olympics is to promote healthy, fair, competition.
68. ChicIndy200 | 08.22.08
I had doubts before. But I just watched a video shot in 2003. Several girls were interviewed when they were in a training camp preparing for the 2008 games. Four girls told the reporter at that time how old they were. Two of them later on appeared in 2008 games. One said she was 12 at the time the video was shot, and the other said she was 11. They would be 17 and 16 in 2008. This seems to corroborate the claim that they were old enough. The video, in Chinese is linked here http://player.youku.com/player.php/sid/9481903/v.swf. I think this issue should be laid to bed.
69. Alex | 08.22.08
The issue will be laid to bed when we get the paperwork from the Chinese government agency and see why they changed their passports last minute.
71. Casey | 08.22.08
No matter what their age, the Chinese gymnasts are wonderful athletes and deserved to win the gold medal. I do not think there should be a minimum age limit restricting those who are allowed to compete. If you are good enough, you should compete. Simple as that.
72. Chris | 08.22.08
Casey: “No matter what their age, the Chinese gymnasts are wonderful athletes and deserved to win the gold medal. I do not think there should be a minimum age limit restricting those who are allowed to compete. If you are good enough, you should compete. Simple as that.”
I actually agree with you, but the fact remains that there is currently a rule in place that states you must be 16 to compete in gymnastics at the Olympic games.
73. PrincessAldora | 08.22.08
casey,
rules r rules, if they’re meant to be broken to easily, den they ain’t called rules..
just play fair.. if they say u gotta be 16, u’d better make sure dat ur 16.. if she’s really 14, then she can wait to enter the next Olympic games.. just like drinking alcohol–u’ll be held accountable if ur underage.. if u knw the rules of the game, just play by them =)
rules are established for the purpose of upholding integrity and fairness in the games in the first place…
74. Alex | 08.22.08
Think about what having no age rules will mean. A 12-year olds being pushed to compete with 19-year olds? Would you like that for your own child? It’s like having 4th graders and high school juniors taking math tests together. Really?
I mean, some young kids are very talented but some, if not most, will just be crushed. Kexin, who obviously can handle it, is just an exception.The rules are designed to protect the other children from burning out and getting injured by the time they reach adolescence. And from being expected to battle mature gymnasts like Liukin.
76. ChicIndy200 | 08.22.08
You should read this ESPN article
http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/summer08/gymnastics/news/story?id=3547713
They did provide additional documents.
“He said the governing body of gymnastics was given additional documents Thursday night to try to dispel lingering questions. Those documents included He’s current and former passport, ID card and family residence permit. Lu said the documents all say she was born in 1992, which would have made her eligible to compete. Gymnasts must turn 16 during the Olympic year to be eligible.”
77. Again | 08.22.08
You guys are the same ******* that though iraq was responsible for 9/11.
The documents have already been produced and verified by the IOC. I think some other guy found a 2003 video that cooraborate that ages were legal
Asian people are routinely mistaken to by 5 - 10 yrs younger than they really are, because you can’t really compare different races that way. Definitely not 2 years.
78. ChicIndy200 | 08.22.08
There are also reports listing in which year He entered Sports Academy at each level. The lowest level is an academy for children, and He entered in 1997. This again is consistent with the normal age, which is five, for a child to be admitted into gymnastics programs at an academy for children. These are facts.
79. Alex | 08.22.08
Luckily for people who don’t cheat, the next Olympics are not in Beijing 
Until then, we will just be patient.
81. serendipity | 08.22.08
In four years, He Xing will be only 18 and will still be of an age when she can compete and win at the Olympic level. Nastia Liukin, whose country observed the age requirements and did not send her to the Athens Olympics when she was 14 four years ago, will be 22 when the 2012 Olympics come around - too old to be a realistic medal contender.
So, by cheating, He Xing gets two bites at the apple, while Nastia only gets one in her entire life. Sound fair to you?
82. Alex | 08.22.08
Serendipity, who knows if this girl will survive physically until 2012. Have you noticed that China never has a girl compete for more than 1-2 years? They exhaust them completely and throw them away.
By 2012 the US will have many other gymnasts and so will Russia and Romania who are not going to allow such a shame to occur a second time. This was their one bite: the Beijing competition. Now they have to go back to the real world.
83. JamesBond008 | 08.22.08
Maybe it would be helpful, if you would know that one of the reserves for US lady gymnastics has a Vietnamese origin, and her weight and height are similar to those of the Chinese girls whose ages are questioned
84. messagebin03 | 08.22.08
The Chinese coach has already submitted He’s old passport, residence card and her birth certificate–and they all show that she’s 16. If you guys read the articles more closely it’s very clear. Also you should take a look at the video chiccindy said. It was a documentary made about Beijing preparations for the Olympics before all this controversy.
However I believe most of you won’t believe even it if all evidence (except the disputed online documents) show that He is 16. And I think most of you don’t want the Olympics in Beijing in the first place no matter how great it went and will find things wrong with it even if the age controversy didn’t happen. The Bejing Olympics isn’t for you prejudiced people anyways and I am glad the remainder of America and the world enjoyed it immensely. That’s the real world.
By the way for those claiming the sky in beijing will always be gray, did you even watch the men’s vollyball final last night? The sky was brilliant blue.
85. Jon | 08.22.08
to Again:
Im fairly sure Iraq has nothing to do with the 2008 Olympics. Seeing as though I have been to Iraq twice now Im not sure how the two relate. Stick to the TOPIC….
86. TJ | 08.22.08
16? He’s birthdate is 1/1/1992, which makes her almost 17! Now, do you belive that?
87. Alex | 08.22.08
No, TJ, I don’t believe that. I have taught English to 16-year Chinese girls and yes, they are small and cute and fine-featured but not this small. I don’t believe it and it’s too bad I can’t prove anything.
88. Jon | 08.22.08
Ok first of all im for whatever is right under the rules. I certainly have my doubts of her age just by looking at her. In fact the whole time I was watching the team event with my friends all we could talk about was how young they looked. Besides that if the IOC or whoever finds she can keep her gold some people will still have that seed of doubt. Although Ms. Kexin could have possibly lied to media but ultimately if the allegations are proved to be true she as well is a victim. AND FOR WHAT? I doubt that she came up with this thing on her own…
89. ChicIndy200 | 08.22.08
The 16-year-old Chinese girls you met are perhaps average girls, but these gymnasts are not average Chinese girls, just like Shawn is not an average 16-year-old American girl. They select athletes based on how tall and how slim their parents are, and they control their weight strictly. On a scale of 1% to 100% percentile, their weight and size are probably at the 1% percentile.
90. Jon | 08.22.08
ChicIndy200
Well I would say that they are average girls in extraordinary circumstances……
91. ian | 08.22.08
James Bond, can you give us the name of the Vietnamese girl on the US Gymnastics team? If she has the same weight and height as He Kexin, does that prove that she too is underage?
92. ChicIndy200 | 08.22.08
I agree with you. Extraordinary circumstances indeed. It takes years to train a gymnast for olympic games. The coaches should have planned who their athletes would be years ahead of the games.
93. ChicIndy200 | 08.22.08
By the way, the video I linked to shows how many girls were in the training camp in 2003. It is amazing they had so many young athletes preparing for the games. One even got hurt very badly. The athletes have made so many sacrifices. It is sad to see this issue hanging around these girls.
94. Jon | 08.22.08
Well I worry that the Chinese govt and even the coaches are ultimately using these young gymnasts and now potentially emotionally damaging a teenage girl. I mean I look back when I was her age(whatever that is) trying out for soccer teams and sometimes not making it and ultimately want to quit. By all means it wasn’t the Olympics but it thats what I went through I can’t imagine how this is going to feel if they take this away from her.
95. ChicIndy200 | 08.22.08
Again, agreed. I do not envy these girls. It’s a tough business. The girl who got hurt may never do gymnastics again. I think we should separate the emotions toward the government from the emotions toward the girls. These girls seem to be willing to do what it takes though. The interesting thing is the video showed a classroom in which these girls learn things other than gymnastics. The coach and instructor seem to take the responsibility of caring for these young girls very seriously.
96. Jay | 08.22.08
Were the Olympics diminished four years ago when our best gymnast, Nastia Lukin, couldn’t compete because she wasn’t 16?
Maybe it’s a bad rule but it is currently the rule and for some countries to violate it is cheating and thus manifestly unfair. Beyond the simple question of cheating by violating the rule, the Chinese government has engaged in a systematic campaign of document falsification and lying in order to perpetrate their cheating. Is that what the Olympics is supposed to stand for?
97. JamesBond008 | 08.22.08
ian:
I got that info from watching one of NBC morning Olympic reporting. The words were from an American lady, who said that different gene could be a factor. And she mentioned the Vietnamese girl as backup reserves for the lady gym-team, who has almost the same small built as the Chinese girls. You could either contact NBC to get that info, or directly contact the US Olympic team.
98. Tony Su | 08.22.08
This age controversy was only stirred up by some US media because of jealousy and ignorance. Now even HACKER got involved in this campaign. How desperate! Since when hacker discovery of some faulty government web pages can be treated as solid “evidence”? How painful is losing the gold medal race!
It’s so convenient to denounce Chinese government media at one time, then treated it as the most authoritative at another (100% correctness?!). Those posted age information was just the mistakes made by some lazy or careless Chinese reporters or web page creators. How about those Chinese web sites reported correct age information? They were conveniently ignored by the US media.
Here we observe vividly the double standards US media has over China. When an American is accused of doing some doping thing, etc, they ask for being considered as innocent unless proved otherwise. Now, they just stir up this media hysteria and presumed Chinese guilty unless proved otherwise.
An old video circulated on Chinese web sites clearly showed that those girls were recruited when China was awarded Olympics and it mentioned they would be 16 years old in 2008.
BTW, many Chinese girls do look very young comparing to Westerners, and some even appear younger than most other Chinese girls. If you don’t know that, you have not seen enough. To most Americans, all Chinese gymnastists in the team look like under 16 years old, not just those three being suspected. There are Chinese girls in their 20s look like 14-year-old to even Chinese.
99. ian | 08.22.08
Found it. The girl is Ivana Hong. Her parents are Chinese-Vietnamese, i.e. ethnic Chinese born in Vietnam. Her mother’s story of escape from VN is quite harrowing.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/15/sports/othersports/15araton.html?_r=1&ref=sports&oref=login
Ivana was born in December 1992, making her barely elligible for the 2008 Olympics. Kexin’s “previously official” birthdate is 01/01/1994, a year younger than Hong. If her “newly official” birthdate of 01/01/92 is correct, she is one year older than Hong. In either case they’re not too far apart in age. It all comes down to which “official” version is the truth.
100. JamesBond008 | 08.22.08
ian,
Good, you got that info already.
If we just look at sizes of the girls, there is another Chinese diving girl Wang Xin (Got blonz), 16 years of age who is even smaller and lighter than He Kexin. I do not think that size should be the only thing to look at….
101. red blooded american | 08.23.08
1) I didnt know that we had so many fools in America, which i guess explains the presidency of Bush.
2) There are (many) conflicting Chinese documents about Kexin’s age, some say 13, 14, and some 16. I am not in a position to call Kexin a liar, and neither are the instant Asian age-verification experts.
3) Get over it, we got our butts kicked, on to London.
102. Aalto | 08.23.08
Why did not they just provide an old family photo dated 1992 showing the baby Kexin?
103. Quincy | 08.23.08
I think Michael Phelp looks like a female. The IOC should have “him” checked out.
104. Hello World | 08.23.08
I think the Olympics Committee of Beijing should go to their basement and find two extra spared gold medals and award them to the US media for:
1. Whining (sounds like “winning”)
2. Spreading propaganda
And if there’s a third one, it should go to the great American public for being such a hypocrite time after time.
105. Simon | 08.23.08
I don’t know what is worse? A Russian born and bred in Moscow from a Russian gymnastic family until she was 3 but still goes back there to stay every so often representing USA or question about a gymnast might be under 16 a rule that was only applied in 1997 reasons were to protect a gymnast’s health not necessary giving them an advntage?
106. K La | 08.23.08
Hi - He Kexin’s surname is He first name is Kexin. The allegations of underage competitors did not originate with the media. Individuals in the U.S. started to search prior competition reports that are public record, up on the web and the like, in China. They also searched Chinese gymnastic federation pdf files and found what appears to be evidence. These individuals then made copies of the pages and urls where the info was located. Interestingly in the last 3/4 days that information has been removed from these websites.
107. CourtneyB | 08.23.08
Hey wiseman, this investigation didn’t start because she looks young. It started because there are government websites that state her birthday as 1/1/94. There are also news stories from last year that give her age as 13. Those stories and the websites have been erased.
There is enough evidence to warrant an investigation, and the evidence didn’t come from “jingoistic American journalists.” It came from the Chinese government.
109. Collin | 08.23.08
redbloodedamerican
You are not seeing the point. It doesn’t matter if you’re american or not. I’m American and I don’t even care that we lost and I’m not mad that we didn’t win that medal. The real issue is that there is much controversy over the discovery of evidence that Kexin is under aged. Kexin may have been better than the other competing gymnast, but that doesn’t change the fact that she broke the rules. Look at it like this, lets say Sri Lanka(notice i didn’t use America because you would jump on the opportunity to call me an American idiot in less that a second)had a gymnast who was better than Kexin by far due to her size and other factors of being younger in age, but she was fifteen years old so she didn’t go to the Olympics because she “obeyed the rules”. It would not be fair to deny her the right to compete in gymnastics at the Olympics while Kexin went and competed and won. Also the hypothetical situation I just thought up could have occurred on numerous occasions in this example of why Kexin competed unfairly. So before you blame all this on us being “fools in America”, know that this controversy is an international problem having to with age not one country not wanting to admit defeat.
110. MichaelSF | 08.24.08
Wow, He kexi and George Bush and WMD. Thanks God she is not on the presidential ticket. If she were, I vote for her over McCain because Republicans has been lying.
If George Bush hadn’t gotten elected, our gymastic would had won all the golds. Why not, becuae all the world is against us.
111. Cynthia | 08.24.08
“Remember back especially women if they were carded or being informed that they looked younger it was considered a compliment.”
Melive, I agree that looking young is a lot of fun in social situations. It is less fun when the assumption leads to unfounded allegations of wrong-doing.
112. ian | 08.25.08
Cynthia,
“Unfounded” allegations? What is the definition of “unfounded”? A bunch of official Chinese government documents and Party Mouthpiece newspaper articles (which have since been mysteriously removed) are not sufficient? One can understand the predicament faced by Jacques Rogge, since he and the IOC have always been in the Chinese pocket, but bystanders like us who have no dog in this fight should be able to see things more objectively. I’m not anti-Chinese. I just prefer to call a duck a duck, even if it’s a Peking one.
113. Wal | 08.25.08
The Chinese govt should get the gold medal for destroying evidence after the world has already seen it, not just once, but repeatedly. The Chinese govt would know that what is termed “obstruction of justice” in the US only makes one look more guilty if only they stopped arresting their top lawyers.
And if it weren’t for the age limit you would have seen all of these many years junior gymnasts do spectacular skills on the international stage such as a quad on floor or triple back dismount on bars that would make He Kexin’s Li Ya combo pale in comparison. I thought Kim Gwan Suk’s combo was far more exciting, but it’s too bad her country (N. Korea) is poor and couldn’t sufficiently bribe the IOC. If N. Korea would just do like China and use their slave labor to generate enormous foreign reserves (hint: arrest people for meditating against the national interest), Kim Gwan Suk would have an Olympic gold medal on bars and probably another gold for 1993 Worlds.
114. Mike | 08.26.08
ian,
Chinese passport, ID card and birth certificate or “official Chinese government documents and Party Mouthpiece newspaper articles”, which ones do you trust?
115. ian | 08.26.08
Mike, having lived in a communist country, I can say with 100% surety that one should NEVER take anything affiliated with a communist government at face value. They are capable of the most unthinkable and heinous acts. Doctoring official documents is mere child’s play. Jailing newspaper journalists or editors who stray from Party line is practically routine.
We’ll probably never find out the truth in this matter (since the government has shredded the records) but that doesn’t mean we have to swallow this **** like Rogge did.
116. Mike | 08.26.08
ian,
Looks like you’re taking “official Chinese government documents and Party Mouthpiece newspaper articles” at face value.
117. ian | 08.28.08
Mike,
Contrariwise, I’m not taking any of their reports at face value. All we know is that there are discrepancies in the various papers. Which naturally raises suspicion. And, knowing how easy it is for the commies to create fake documents and remove archived server contents and restrict internet access, it’s reasonable to assume that somebody’s lying and/or trying to hide something.
Trackbacks/Pingbacks
(Websites that are linking to this article)
Leave a Comment
We do not publish all comments, and we do not publish comments immediately. The comments feature is a forum to discuss the ideas in our stories. Constructive debate – even pointed disagreement – is welcome, but personal attacks on other commenters are not, and will not be published.
Please do not post any comments that are commercial in nature or that violate copyrights.
Finally, we will not publish any comments that we regard as obscene, defamatory, or intended to incite violence.
1. Jim | 08.22.08
The simple fact is that the IOC has established and accepted rules that, over time, may be updated. If He followed the rules, then kudos to her for an outstanding medal-deserving performance. If she did not follow the rules, then she should relinquish her achievements to the silver medalists who deserve to be awarded what is rightfully due to them.
It simply doesn’t matter how good her performance is, when she happened to perform it, or even how good her teeth are. If it is proven that she broke the rules, then she must be held accountable and deal with the resulting consequences.