Republican presidential nominee John McCain makes a point to Democratic rival Barack Obama (r.) during their Oct. 15 debate in Hempstead, N.Y. CBS's Bob Schieffer moderated. (Charles Dharapak/Reuters)
A feisty McCain, a cool Obama, and appeals to ‘Joes’ everywhere
In last presidential debate, McCain makes starkest break yet with Bush, invokes an Ohio plumber to discredit Obama's tax policies.
By Linda Feldmann | October 16, 2008 edition
Reporter Linda Feldmann talks with csmonitor.com's Pat Murphy about the final presidential debate and what lies ahead for the candidates.
Washington
John McCain brought an aggressive game face to the final presidential debate Wednesday night, putting his Democratic rival for the presidency, Barack Obama, on the defensive.
But in his trademark style, Senator Obama kept his cool, smiling at times as Senator McCain unloaded on him. Obama’s answers were calm and lawyerly. The Illinois senator did not hurt himself, and thus remains the odds-on favorite to win in November. His average national lead in major polls has grown to more than seven percentage points, and he is ahead in several states that voted Republican four years ago.
Still, the race is by no means over, and McCain clearly came to Hofstra University, the debate site, with some points to make. Most memorably, he announced that he was fed up with being lashed to the side of the unpopular president, George W. Bush, and made the starkest break with him yet: “Senator Obama, I am not President Bush,” he asserted. “If you wanted to run against President Bush, you should have run four years ago.”
Since launching his campaign, Obama has repeatedly stated that a President McCain would represent a third term of President Bush, pursuing what Obama likes to call the same “failed policies.” Polls show that many voters agree with that characterization. Realistically, if McCain had intended to divorce himself completely from Mr. Bush, he would have had to do it months or even years ago. Conservatives like Newt Gingrich tout French President Nicolas Sarkozy as the model for how to succeed an unpopular president from one’s own party – in his case, Jacques Chirac. The difference is that Mr. Sarkozy split from Mr. Chirac long before the French election, and succeeded in persuading voters that he would be more of a change agent than the opposition party.
If McCain goes on to lose on Nov. 4, he can rightfully blame Bush for defeating him twice – first in 2000, when McCain lost the nomination battle with the future president, and now in 2008, says Floyd Ciruli, an independent pollster based in Denver.
“McCain simply cannot plow through this with this burden,” says Mr. Ciruli.
As for who “won” the Wednesday debate, polls showed Obama coming out on top. A CBS poll of uncommitted voters scored it 53 percent to 22 percent for Obama. CNN came in at 58 percent to 31 percent for Obama. But it may be too soon to gauge whether McCain’s attacks on Obama over his past association with former ’60s radical William Ayers had any effect. Voters say they don’t like negativity in candidates, but going negative can work.
By raising the subject of Mr. Ayers, which he was under pressure to do, McCain answered the call of supporters and party strategists that he should get tough with Obama on this and other controversial figures in Obama’s past, like his former pastor, the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, famous for making incendiary comments about America. Despite pleas from some strategists, McCain opted against bringing up Reverend Wright, reportedly because he does not want to risk looking racist.
But Ayers was fair game: “I don’t care about an old washed-up terrorist,” McCain said. “But as Senator [Hillary Rodham] Clinton said in her debates with you, we need to know the full extent of that relationship.”
Obama came ready with a reply on Ayers, who once held a fundraiser for Obama early in his political career and who served on an educational board with Obama. Ayers is now an education professor in Chicago. Obama called Ayers’s radical acts “despicable” and noted that he, Obama, was just a boy at the time and did not know Ayers.
Obama’s ability to keep his cool under fire – and not attack back – “should certainly have an initial positive for Obama,” says Ben Voth, a forensics expert at Southern Methodist University in Dallas. “The question is whether any lingering doubts would creep in later.”
Mr. Voth also says McCain’s “base of supporters were probably satisfied that he did venture into the aggressive waters they wanted him to.”
McCain’s biggest problems are that there are fewer than three weeks until Election Day, and the nation is in a financial crisis. A bad economy is poison to the party that controls the White House, and McCain came right out of the starting gate Wednesday night aiming to show sympathy with the people – and promising action.
“Americans are hurting right now, and they’re angry,” he said, calling his fellow citizens “innocent victims of greed and excess on Wall Street as well as Washington, D.C.”
McCain then returned to a major proposal that he had laid out, with no fanfare, in the last debate, suggesting the federal government buy up shaky mortgages to stabilize the housing market. But his most memorable economic argument of the evening centered on taxes, with “Joe the plumber” as the lead character. Joe Wurzelbacher is a plumber in Toledo, Ohio, who had an extended conversation with Obama a few days ago about the senator’s plan to raise taxes on those making more than $250,000. The conversation was caught on camera, and conservatives have seized on Obama’s comment on how “when you spread the wealth around, it’s good for everybody.”
McCain repeatedly returned to “Joe the plumber” throughout the 1-1/2 hour debate, turning him into the Everyman who reaches for the American dream, only to see the government raise his taxes when he succeeds.
“Joe, I want to tell you, I’ll not only help you buy that business that you worked your whole life … and I’ll keep your taxes low and I’ll provide available and affordable healthcare for you and your employees,” McCain said.
Obama replied by turning the focus back to the middle class: “What I want to do is to make sure that the plumber, the nurse, the firefighter, the teacher, the young entrepreneur who doesn’t yet have money, I want to give them a tax break now,” he said. “And that requires us to make some important choices.”
Joe the plumber has no doubt now joined the cast of Joes already populating the campaign – alongside the two running mates, Joe Six-Pack (aka Sarah Palin) and Joe Biden.
Comments
2. Chuck | 10.16.08
With total disregard to the rest of the article, I’m pretty sure that should be feisty no?
3. peanuts | 10.16.08
Ok, OBAMA wants to play Robin Hood…spread the wealth around…steal from the rich and give to the poor. It won’t work. The economy has already tanked and our banks are now no longer privatized. We are in trouble and Obama and McCain can’t fix it in 4 years or even in 8 years.
4. Rob Bryant | 10.16.08
A cool Obama? BO was anything but ‘cool’. I saw a definsive Obama, and uncomfortable Obama, an inexperienced Obama. You don’t uncomfortably smile and look down and call that cool.
5. Kathy | 10.16.08
The wealth redistribution needs to be hammered home and hard. I know quite a few people that live in 300,000. houses, take at least 2 high end trips a year etc. that think life has cheated them simply because the guy next door has more. Every Obama supporter needs to answer this question and honestly-”how much -dollar amount please-are you willing to give so that all those with less can have more?” And bone up on socialist and communist countries and see if you’d want to live in one.
6. Annette in Florida | 10.16.08
Very good article, thank you. It’s refreshing to read a real journalistic piece without bias. It’s so hard to find balanced stories these days.
Keep up the good work.
7. K.T.Samuel | 10.16.08
Iam from Malaysia.To me Obama was the winner.He is cool & stylish .He is with substance.
8. Eddie Zalez | 10.16.08
Mr. McCain’s frustration was visible; he did not score any major points nor was able to change his game addressing the American people in this last important debate. He finally realized his campaign wasted three or four weeks of valuable time attacking Mr. Obama on a mute issue: Mr. Ayers past. Again, the cool junior senator, “that one” from Illinois, came out smelling like a rose.
9. joe the electrician | 10.16.08
I really respect Obama. He has the right temperment.
I disagree with McCain’s views on education and healthcare. We need school improvement across the board not vouchers. With vouchers some schools will get left behind. We can’t afford that. You can run but you can’t hide. We need to improve all our schools in every community.
OBAMA 08
10. Chase | 10.16.08
Obama constantly says Bush has had 8 years of failed policies, but as President you can only decide on what is brought to you by Congress which is Democratic majority. So it’s the money hungry Dems. making the failed policies.
12. mike | 10.16.08
McCain clearly won’t have many people to give his tax breaks to if the people he wants to help can’t get their businesses off the ground.
13. Litwin | 10.16.08
The whole concept of symbolizing small business to the American public as “Joe the Plumber” was as condescending as his running mate referencing the average American as “Joe Six-Pack.” Frankly, I don’t identify with either Joe. I’m not a rip-off plumber, and I’m not a beer-guzzling slob.
McCain didn’t put Obama on the defensive. He simply has nothing better to offer the people, so he must resort at attacking Obama’s strategies, which Obama deflected masterfully with each attack.
14. george from ohio | 10.16.08
being torn between these 2 for a while, when mcain chose palin, it turned entire race into a reality tv show. everyone who can read can figure out this move was to get hillarys voters. mcains real issue was the inexperience of obama, that issue went out the window with having palin a heartbeat away from being president, and her husband, who she calls first dude sittiing in the whitehouse. even the most intense republicans and democrats i know are insulted by being refered to as joe six pack, its like if she called every women suzy the barefoot breader. believe it or not , not all american men sit around and drink beer every day an rub our beer guts. please, im 47 years old, great shape and full of ambition. raising 5 kids and making it work. pathetic
15. R. Norris | 10.16.08
How can anyone suppport a tax plan that sends taxpayer’s dollars to people who do not even pay taxes?
17. Richard | 10.16.08
I cannot disagree more, McCain brought up topics that made Obama look like he was having gas pains, “beatific smile” please. What a ridiculous description. Sounds to me like you are trying to saint an average politician who has no experience and no business being in a presidential race……
18. James Edwards | 10.16.08
One key thing was clearly demonstrated to me in this last presidential debate of 08. And that is how each of the candidates operate under pressure. One was erratic and visibly desperate. The other was calculated, composed and clear. This reveals the mannerisms and methods that each of the candidates would likely employ during a crisis. It is clear to me which one has the intellect, strength and patience to command and be chief. ‘That one’!
19. mike | 10.16.08
thank God for Joe the plumber he has put a face on the tax payer that Obama is going to tax.It is people like me and the average American tax payer that will sufer.I know alot of people that do not pay taxes and live off the system they do not want to get a job they want to stay on the system goverment hand outs that are paid for from my taxes.Obama want to spread my wealth around I dont think so.
20. katharine | 10.16.08
I think it was great that McCain brought up Joe the plumber. I went and saw the video on youtube, and was amazed at how intelligent, knowledgeable, engaged, and caring Obama was talking to this man. He clearly explained his policies without talking down, but talking with him. He made good sense, especialy about how if everyone is doing well the plumber will have the customers he depends on for his business to thrive. This was the part that McCain misconstrued and pounced on with the socialist label, trying to make Obama look radical, but if you see the conversation, he just looked smart, involved, compassionate and right.
21. Scotty | 10.16.08
Okay John, I got your message loud and clear: You only care about folks making over $250,000. Not exactly your “average” Joe?
So what are WE (the other 95% of Americans)? Chopped liver?
Thanks, but no thanks.
22. Chris K. | 10.16.08
Giving the tax break to the middle class, who really does not have to pay a whole lot of taxes to begin with will do nothing to stimulate the economy. Giving these tax breaks to small businesses so that they will actually have cash flow during tax season can and will stimulate the jobs necessary to boost this economic downturn. McCain’s plan is necessary to help correct this huge problem.
23. William P | 10.16.08
McCain didnt do what he was suppose to do last night. He did something, but not what he was suppose to. He didnt attack Obama on his associations with Ayers, Wright, Resko, or Acorn. He didnt ask for a detailed list of the page by page programs he was going to slash. He didnt do enough to show the American public that Obama is slippery with his words to say the least. He didnt point out times when Obama said he was going to grow jobs, which meant raise taxes/spend. That being said, If I had to make a decision based on things that McCain did or didnt bring up, I would vote McCain 100 times over, and I am as middle class as it gets. Please someone tell me how democrats are justifying allowing this man to run our country. He is more radical than anyone can imagine and is guilty by association.
24. Jim Davis | 10.16.08
Show me one plumber who takes home $250000 a year.
Even doctors have it difficult making that kind of money.
It goes to show how out of touch the Republican party is what is really happening to the middle class around the country.
26. Jeanne | 10.16.08
I am 75 years old and am so fed up with McCain’s blustery, sneering face that I definitely will not vote for him. I voted for him in the primary election and have seen him turn himself into a bitter man. After following Obama and McCain on their campaign stumps I know that Obama is by far the most intelligent, highly educated, person for the office of president.
The worst mistake McCain made was not just his sneering grin with negative remarks throughout the campaign, but it was in selecting Sarah Palin who is a mockery to women.
27. Nova | 10.16.08
McCain laughs at the idea that a woman might need to end a pregnancy for health reasons? What is wring with him? I guess McCain is now going to rank my children in order of importance for me. I need to be healthy to raise the kids I already have. McCain came off as very callous and thoughtless.
28. Dgraham | 10.16.08
Gee, my cousin in France, when he lost his job a couple of years ago, decided to change from working in after-sales service for repairing lawn mowers etc to opening his own restaurant (okay he’s a good chef). Somehow that government,despite the fact they supposedly tax more heavily than we do, has given him the support he needs and he is doing okay despite the economy. Can you imagine a bank here being willing to loan a 50 year old guy money to open a restaurant in a small small small town (500 people)…and guess what he doesn’t even have to worry about healthcare.
29. Kelly | 10.16.08
You know for someone that does not care about an old washed up terrorist he sure seems to bring him up a heck of a lot. Sen McCain brings him up constantly, seems obsessed with him, has made him the base of his campaign and this is not careing about the guy. This is not what we need, this does not benefit us in any way. This is an attempt to bring fear of the unknown into this election process, because he is trying to say that you should fear Sen. Obama because he will make this guy the education sec. Its crazy, its just crazy. I would be more afraid of Sen. McCain making the guy who said that we as American were a bunch of winers and the recession was mental the sec of treasury, that is a much bigger fear and one that he has said he would do…so who should we trust in their judgement here?
30. Vivifiant | 10.16.08
When I heard the Joe Wurzelbacher story I had to think about the last time I had a plumber in my house. He charged $250 for 1 hours work to connect a new kitchen sink. I studied years to get my graduate an post graduate degrees and make a fraction of that plumber’s income. However, I think the Joes of this country should be able to make all the money they want but they have to pay their taxes. After all, plumbers like Joe, making over $250K are in the top 8% of US incomes…
Vivifiant, Ohio
31. Steve Lundgren | 10.16.08
I think “”both”" candidates are proposing immediate relief for Americans during the current crisis to gain advantage. “”Both”" candidates proposals will cost money. The money for these proposals must come from somewhere? However, the larger question is long terms benefits and costs of both candidates. I like both candidates, but my research shows that Senator Obama’s idealogies in the long term will look to government to solve our problems and increase it’s size.
Senator McCain’s idea’s look to reduce the size of government which I think all Americans liken to a wild fire that is out of control.
I just wish all Americans would do like “”Joe the Plumer”" said. do your own reading and research of the facts and decide for your self. don’t depend on union leaders or MTV or the media to tell you how to think.
32. Gina | 10.16.08
All know that McCain is the better one for president, but the problem is the age, with the youth craze around, but you had better vote for the old one and get the economy fixed, the risk with the unexperienced one is far higher to destroy US economy completely than the elder one who has a lot of knowledge and experience. Obama was like an empty suit. What is a young president good for, he only can be president 8 years, McCain is 72 now, he could be president until 80. I know a lot of people who are fit at 80 and McCain is a really tough fighter for 72, I think he still has lots of energy and is able to run the county until age 80. You should wipe off this age prejudice.
33. Suzy | 10.16.08
McCain seemed bombastic and full of himself, and displayed more petty anger than real leadership. Does he think talking about “hurt feelings” will help his campaign?
34. Brian | 10.16.08
A good and fair synopsis of the debate. But why the random quote from a “forensics expert at Southern Methodist University in Dallas” as if he were a political expert ?
35. Odenn | 10.16.08
Obama continues to string McCain along. His bid for the Presidency will be one that is won by popularity and massive TV/Radio ad budgets.
The only way McCain can win now, is for something shocking to come out about Obama.
38. Chris | 10.16.08
It’s amazing that Obama didn’t bring up Keating since it was an early indication of what’s happening in the financial sector now. Even if McCain was found not guilty, he thought supporting a friend’s (Keating’s) move was more important than consequences - McCain got “fooled” like so many financial CEOs might try to claim now, but REALLY, it was more of looking the other way and not wanting to know details. McCain has poor judgment and makes decisions based on emotion more than facts - something he and running mate Palin have in common. Obama should win by a landslide.
39. Thomas Whitker Stults | 10.16.08
Were the Government to limit its activities to those set forth in the Constitutional blueprint so brilliantly hammered out by the Founders, the tax burden would be so light as to warrant little or no comment or incite so much controversy. No one in either Major Party cares to pursue such a concept, but were anyone to do so, the so-called “debates” (beauty ontests, really) would provoke much less attention.
40. pat s austin | 10.16.08
John McCain cannot save water and flush his bathroom.(have his cake and eat it) How will he pay for some of his proposals? He has no specific answers for his many proposals.He and Bush are synonymous.(90% of the time on major issues) Bush and MCain are mataphors for each other. As for Joe the plumber, his business might be worth 250000, but what is his possibility of making 250 thousand dollars,a year that will be taxed. Average Joe’s do not make 250 thousand profit to be taxed.The average is above 90% of small businesses who make less.So relax Joe, there are other plumbers too, who want to make some money. Joe ,let’s be realistic, that’s plenty messed up toilets making 250 grand!Hope you can make that.
42. Granthamicus | 10.16.08
If Joe is making 250k a year then good for him, but the infrastructure and political environment that allowed him to have that opportunity is not free.
Joe isn’t hurting and won’t soon feel any pinch with regard to taxes I suspect.
We all come along together in this country or we all fail together.
43. Jay | 10.16.08
“Fiesty?” But McCain wasn’t really feisty — he sounded belligerent and desperate. In this debate, Obama’s campaign, and plan for his presidency, looked like a well-organized settlement, with McCain somewhere on the outskirts grabbing sticks, setting them alight, and trying to shoot them like arrows into Obama’s camp, hoping they stick to something flammable. A random, ill-considered set of attacks. I would expect a McCain White House to be about as constructive.
44. Pearl | 10.16.08
I am disgusted with the strategy of McCain in this race because obviously, the mode of operandi is to discredit Obama and create doubt due to the fact that they have lost tons of credibility and have no viable plans or at least no plans which are better or more sound than Obama’s. In each and every debate, McCain behaved like a bulldog and instead of moving forward and truly debating the issues at hand, he consistently attacked Obama on happenings which are debatable in regards to form and content. No matter how much Obama attempted to redirect the debate to issues at hand, Mr. McCain bulldoggishly insisted upon making personal attacks. I do not think that most Americas were watching debates to hear McCain attack Obama as this is something that happens on the campaign trail. It was said to see a person who has been in government thin long behave this way. However, it was clear that Mr. McCain has lasted in politics by being a bully.
45. klc | 10.16.08
Odd that McCain and Palin keep bringing up Obama’s possible ties to Ayers when Sarah Palin’s close ties to the Alaskan Independent Party and her husband was a member of it.
46. JennyO | 10.16.08
I don’t understand why McCain is so bothered by the idea of “spreading the wealth around”: 50% of Americans make less than $32,000, and a measly 5% make more than $250,000. The complete obliteration of the middle class is a huge problem, and it means that some of that wealth concentrated at the top _needs_ to be spread around.
47. Cameron Stokes | 10.16.08
Obama appeared presidential and appropriately cool. McCain continued his dead end questions about Obama’s associations, pushing into dead air even after Obama had explained his relationships thoroughly and accurately, (according to the fact checking sites I’ve visited). McCain continually comes off as less than sincere, with his odd repetition of “friends” in the last debate and uncomfortable half laughter at legitimate points from the Dems. McCain seems to make the most sense when he lets out a quick, seemingly uncensored, retort.
Barely noticeable, he’s done this two or three times during the last two debates before launching into his canned responses or rolling back to the talking points. I’d like to hear more of that McCain.
48. Ron | 10.16.08
In what universe is it fair that I’ve got to “share the (my) wealth” with those who haven’t been as fortunate as I. Everyone has the same opportunities, although some do have to work harder to overcome obstacles, so let them earn their own million. Who’s to say what constitutes happiness, as in “the pursuit of happiness,” in my life? Maybe I don’t feel secure if I don’t have a million cash in the bank, maybe I really, really want to own a Bugatti, or maybe I just want to leave my children in much better shape. Why in the world should I give 80% or whatever of my top dollars to the government to spread around to some highschool dropout or someone who had three kids by the time they were 20? Yes, some need help in life and I have no problem with helping them, but if you just haven’t made it yet, keep working at it and you will.
Ron, Oklahoma
49. Westland | 10.16.08
Amen, Vivifiant. I like plumbers as much as the next homeowner, but I hardly see them as economically disenfranchised. They always have a jobs; they enjoyed a relatively abbreviated education; their technology was more or less set during the days of the Roman Empire, the only recent advance being the toilet in the 19th century. Yet plumbers can count on being paid more than most of those who have have toiled years for post-graduate degrees, and have to keep up with advances in technology — doctors, professors, and scientists. These are the people that will contribute most to America’s innovation and technology future, and who are needed to offer both parties health care programs.
50. Robert Thompson | 10.16.08
Here’s one for your screeners…
This is not a news article. This is a Obama commercial. Please get someone not “in love” with Obama to write AND edit your stories. (An independent minded person.. I not suggesting a McCain supporter..)
Jeez, just looking for information and not your opinion.
51. Matt | 10.16.08
What people seem to ignore is that making $250,000 or more means that you are doing well. Very well. I’m making a small fraction of that and am getting by. Since when was the American dream making a quarter million dollars a year and owning a bunch of junk? What happened to the American family, the Americna pet, and the American home? While I applaud Joe the Plumber (who seems to have been mentioned more that the candidates running for President), the President of the United States can’t afford to focus on every single person; they must do what is best for this country, and its people, in general. The people must take care of themselves.
52. Vivifiant | 10.16.08
To Vivifiant, yes, there is no disagreement about the Joes of this country having to pay their taxes. The issue here is raising their taxes (and according to Obama, only the taxes of the 250k+ “wealthy,” to “redistribute wealth,” as decided on the whim of the federal government. So in effect, you tax the business and creative class (cutting the economic growth of the nation), to, hopefully, grow the economy from the bottom up. The long-standing war on poverty has not even come close to any measure of success, demonstarting the futility of this approach. And I sense a great deal of class-envy in your message, indicating the media and the democrats have worked their message on you.
53. Lucie | 10.16.08
Temper, Temper. I recall being right behind a man driving his children to school one morning on my way to work in slow traffic. He continually turned around to shout at a child in the back seat. Eventually shouting turned into blows. Everytime he took a swing at his kid, he swerved into the opposite lane, narrowly missing some oncoming cars. As I took down his plate number to give to the authorities so they could send Protective Services to his house to talk to him child abuse. I remember thinking ” if this is what he does in public, what goes on at home behind closed doors where none of us can see? When will his failure to attend to the road casue an accident because he is so enraged he doesn’t care about anything but his anger?” What I saw last night was an angry, sarcastic, condescending, bitter and easily frustrated old man who has so little self-control he behaves that way in front of a nation. What do you suppose he is like when there are no cameras rolling? The sort of man we need in the Oval Office? Not likely. Right now this country needs an intelligent bridge builder who can maintain a calm, rational and productive demeanor, not the kind of guy who rolls his eyes and snorts disrespectfully at one of his peers and cries foul when he gets caught being negative. Rude, Rude, Rude.
54. Amber | 10.16.08
Obama had meat to his words telling more specifics of what is important to him and always trying to return the discussion to policy. McCain was a little cry baby and couldn’t get over attacks from people not even associated with the Obama campaign. I think Obama said it nicely when McCain was whining, “The American public doesn’t care about our hurt feelings, they care about the issues.”
55. XBOY | 10.16.08
Clearly the polls cited in this article are erroneous, as the last several decades have proven. McCain who the debate on fundamentally sound policies w/o Democratic rhetoric. Does anyone actually beleive anything the Democrats say anymore? On trust, McCain, on integrity, McCain, on love of God and country, McCain. The issues MCain actually believes in and will move forward on. Unlike Obama who is inexperienced, and doesn;t have a clue to what the people of the United States of America think of their Constitution and of the hopes they have for their country.
If McCain pulls this one out, so be it. If Obama wins, God help us from becoming a socialist country giving away all we have fought and died, and earned the past 200+ years.
–Thankyou.
56. LA | 10.16.08
Hahaha! America the funny. I hope the two guys (and their supporters) can shake hands and keep cool after November 4! Quite a lively contest, I must say.
57. Sharon | 10.16.08
Sorry, but I have a hard time boohooing for Joe the Plumber who is clearing 250,000 to 280,000 a year, when Nancy the Nurse is having a hard time paying the mortgage on her mobile home, and I guarantee she is working just as hard as Joe. Mr. McCain’s embrace of trickle down economics, giving huge tax breaks to the wealthy and large companies, has been proven to be a failure and has brought our economy to its knees. Thanks, but no thanks. Eight years is enough.
58. Fred | 10.16.08
Joe the plumber situation should help explain clearly to the undecided voters the difference between McCain and Obama’s economic strategy. Raising taxes and radical government spending as part of Obama’s economic plan may not be appealing to some voters. The Obama/Ayers ties is another factor that may heip the uncommitted voters to weigh carefully its impact to Obama’s judgement and character. Likewise, it may help them make the right decision
whom to vote for US President. May the best candidate win! Good luck!
59. John | 10.16.08
What I wanted McCain to ask Obama is simply this, who gave Joe the money? How did he get in a position to buy the business? Did the government give it to him? Of course the answer is NO. Part of the “American Dream” is working for it. A hand out does not spread the wealth from the upper to the lower classes, it spreads the despair from the bottom up.
60. Howard Schell | 10.16.08
My observations on last night’s debate:
Senator Obama mostly kept his cool, make his points thoughtfully, and refuted McCain’s accusations with logical, complete answers. He was on the defensive more than in past debates, but defended his positions and character well. He looked and sounded “Presidential”, especially when the camera was only on him.
Senator McCain rambled from topic to topic, kept attacking (sometimes with effect), and sometimes made “quippish” remarks that often seemed off base and unrelated to the subject being discussed. He could not shake his negative rhetoric and followed-up several attacks on Senator Obama with phrases similar to “…but I’m running a positive campaign…”
My score: Senator Obama 8 out of 10/McCain 6 out of 10
Bottom line: Senator Obama will get a slight bump from the debate but neither man changed the score much, and that hurts McCain more than Obama at this point in the election cycle.
61. Al | 10.16.08
I make $35,000 and have worked for the same company 30 years. Joe’s doing pretty good if you ask me and definitely doesn’t represent the working class. I do.
62. Ed the Surveyor | 10.16.08
As a small business owner I must tell you that Joe the Plumber has some very unrealistic grandious plans. The very idea that he will show a profit over 250,000.00 any time soon is crazy. He should ecstatic just to be able to take home a pay check and show a profit in this economy. John McCain should try running a small business and live off the income for a few years. His thoughts would change very quickly.
63. J ack M> | 10.16.08
Obama and his tax and spend program is not good for America.
Small business and new jobs will suffer. He does not understand
the economics of our world.
He is a smooth talking person with no experience and is not qualified
to be president.
64. Deinise Oliver-Velez | 10.16.08
All of this focus on “Joe’s” is a bit off-putting to me. Don’t we “Jane’s”, women who make up a majority of the electorate get equal time?
As a female voter, I’m in charge of the family check-book and bank accounts. I have to make the hard decisions about eliminating Christmas gifts this year, so I can pay the heating bill.
I was repelled by Senator McCain’s snide references to “the health” of the mother, during the section of the debate devoted to Roe vs. Wade. He choose to do air quotes with his fingers, and smirk. If you have ever known a woman who has just been told that her fetus does not have a brain, or who has to make the difficult decision to abort because her life is threatened, Senator McCain, you would not be so cavalier.
As a working woman I have many concerns, equal pay for equal work is one of them, and as an older woman, I can’t retire because I get health coverage from my job, and am afraid to lose it. The idea that my health coverage may be taxed is anathema. Does John McCain have any clue what health care costs are for real families?
The final debate was not a game changer for me. Senator McCain just got angrier and nastier, and Senator Obama seemed presidential. In these troubling times we need a calm, intelligent hand on the tiller. I am reminded of my childhood watching Howdy Doody. McCain evokes “Mr Bluster”.
65. Independent in FL | 10.16.08
It was sickening to watch Obama constantly laughing-off serious questions that McCain raised. Does Obama really understand how serious this job is, and just how dangerous this world has become? He just doesn’t seem to get it.
67. Gayle Page | 10.16.08
Lucky plumber, old Joe. I’d give anything to have to pay taxes (even up to 40%) on $250,000 a year. My American dream is just to stay healthy until I die so that I don’t leave behind a load of debts for my kids. Believe me when I say that with my income and lifestyle, if I were making even half of $250,000 a year there would be no debts and I could drive my own car without praying it didn’t break down. Who in the world are these people talking to in the middle class (if there is still such a thing) earning such salaries? McCain is not even aware that people like me exist because he’s never had a real job and always been wealthy.
I am way at the bottom of the trickle down theory, except that I’m too far down for anything of value to actually trickle down on.
Not just another Joe
68. Sherry Ward | 10.16.08
Senator Obama continues to speak calmy and keep his cool, while Senator McCain looks desperate in his continuing attacks and negative comments on Obama. Instead of answering questions or sticking with the issues, Senator McCain almost seems “out of control” at times.
69. Ian Borden | 10.16.08
Your article failed to mention that Obama and Ayers served on a board together in Chicago that was funded by Annenberg, one of Ronald Reagan’s former ambassadors.
70. Mitch | 10.16.08
McCain loss the debate. He continues to demonstrate he is a flawed candidate, but aren’t they all. For me it is a vote for party. Without a doubt the biggest problem facing America is the growth in the size of government. When we as citizens look to the government with belief that they are the only ones who can solve the problems that were originally created by the government, we as a people have failed to meet our duty in a free society.
71. Sam Sara | 10.16.08
McCain used to be such a great candidate for our country. His descent into negativity, his absurd choice of a running mate, and his undeniable affection for Bush policies have diminished his status. McCain clearly came into this debate with a bur in his saddle. He insisted on reformulating nearly everything Obama said into his preconceived notions of what a liberal would do. Obama would calmly outline his plan for energy or health care or education and even though the rest of us heard what Obama said, McCain would repackage Obama’s words - no matter what their content - into the Republican filter, ignore the content of Obama’s message, distort the message, and then aggressively try to force it down our throats! I suspect if Obama had said “it’s cold in here”, McCain might have replied, (rolling eyes) “see Joe plumber, everywhere he (Obama) goes he complains it’s too hot, and blames that on all the hard working plumbers like you…. and these absurd ideas that man caused global warming”.
72. DoTheMath | 10.16.08
Has anyone bothered to do the math to determine if there is a shred of credibility in Joe Wurzelbacher’s claim that Barack Obama’s tax policies are going to prevent him from buying the business that is his American dream?
If Joe buys the plumbing business and nets $300,000, Obama has made no bones about the fact that Joe will be paying a higher rate of tax on the amount Joe makes above $250,000. His marginal tax rate on the $50,000 of income above $250,000 will go up from 36% (the current rate) to 39%.
So for fear that his taxes on this $50,000 will go up a whooping $1,5000 ($50,000 * .03), we’re supposed to believe that Barack Obama’s tax plan is dissuading Joe from buying a business that will otherwise move him up to the upper echelons of American economic success?
Come on America, don’t buy into this trust-baby perpetrated hog-wash.
If Joe Wurzelbacher’s not going to buy this business, it’s not because of a paltry $1,500 tax increase on $300,000 of income. More likely it’s the fear of buying a business that could easily fail in the teeth of a recession brought on by eight years of failed trickle-down economic policies that John McCain still shamelessly promotes as the solution to this country’s economic woes.
73. Bill | 10.16.08
Great view on the debate. I think Obama clearly out shone McCain in many important areas. McCain seemed a little confused and mumbled often.
74. Maxwell Stevens | 10.16.08
I don’t think the debate advanced either candidate, but it certainly clarified one issue for me: neither one of these guys has a clue about the economy. Either they are too scared to face reality and admitt to us how bad it is, or they are just too ignorant to know what to do. McCain wasted his valuable chance flapping and squawking like a disturbed chicken; Obama was calm to the point of being boring. I’m extremely disappointed in both of them and tired of the nonsense that increasingly permeates our political system.
75. Kellie | 10.16.08
Granted, Obama is collected and eloquent in a debate format. But, that cannot be the mark of a good president. When our country elects a candidate that is strongly on one side or the other of the political spectrum, it does us no good. Bush is oober-conservative and, as a result, party politics has become polarized. But, watch out — Obama is more liberal than Bush is conservative. Please, those who want to make a truly informed choice — Ignore his demeanor for a moment and pay attention to the details of his politics. John McCain is no perfect candidate — no one is. But, what I like about him is that he does have years of proving that he tries to find the middle road and work his butt off to get things done, even when it takes siding with the “other side.” We have no evidence of the same history with Obama.
76. Ann Yarmal | 10.16.08
My disappointment is that McCain, whom I admired in 2000, has allowed racism and meanness to take over his campaign, not to mention the shrewd, pragmatic, and stupid mimicking behavior of Palen who with support of the “team” allows vicious anti Obama attacks without standing up for the Constitution and pure American fairness.
77. Brunero | 10.16.08
European citizen with Obama for President !
200.000 fan in Berlin !
Obama is fresh air.
78. Donnee | 10.16.08
Im amazed that in a country as diverse as this one, we can’t come up with another name besides “Joe” to represent the common man. I’d like to see the candidates mention a Jose six pack or a Mohammed, or a Hans, or a Huang Lee, and see what happens to their numbers.
79. Linda Jensen | 10.16.08
It is too bad Obama can’t play poker with McCain for this office. Not only would he be the next president, he might also be able to pick up one or two of McCain’s houses. Obama took McCain’s nastiest hits and moved beyond them to explain is proposals for the economy. Some of those proposals are complex which is appropriate to the problems we face as a nation.
80. mcSherpa | 10.16.08
McCain whines about “lack of experience” then chooses Sarah Palin as his VP. He states he is interested in “Joe Plumber” but then cannot remember how many houses he owns. He is an old, angry old man. You could sense the contempt he held for Obama, who was cool under pressure. While McCain promised to not sling mud during this debate….He DID sling mud…because that is who he is. Obama couldn’t be mean, and couldn’t fire back (especially on the Palin issue which I believe he SHOULD have) because he is a true gentleman. He is the right stuff for America. The day he is elected, will raise our respect level world-wide. In addition, he is smart enough to chose a decent cabinet. Come on people! None are so blind as those who cannot see. Open your eyes!!!!
Another Christian Mama for Obama
81. larry in texas | 10.16.08
I agree….When I heard what McCain had to say on that issue, all I could think about was if “Joe” was making 250k, then he should be paying more in taxes. He is not struggling like the rest of the middle class at that point, and my wife and I both combined only made 65k (sadly enough) and are still struggling, why wouldn’t “Joe” pay more? Obama made perfect sense, to assist them when they started out, instead of when they make the “bigger bucks”, just like what the republican party has always done, help the rich get richer, good going McCain, nice to know anyone who makes over 250k will get better tax breaks than the rest of us “95%” of the middle class that help run this country and pay your salary.Also, couldn’t help but notice that McCain was all about more drilling for oil, not much more on alternative issues, and then giving even bigger breaks to the already rich oil companys for more drilling, sound familiar, “Bush’ism” at its best, sounds like someone else’s pockets being lined with green other than the us, the people.
82. nagamas | 10.16.08
Notice when Obama had the chance to comment on Palin, he stated that to be to where she is (governor of Alaska), she must have skill and he admired her for that. He did not mention Palin’s lack of qualification, unethical behavior in using the governor’s office in her dealing with her ex brother in law or her connection with the extreme Alaska independent party. The list could go on and on. This is the woman who attacked with smear, innuendos and unsubstantiated rumors ad nauseum.
When McCain had the chance to comment about Biden, he went straight away on the attack, citing several of Biden’s voting records that in his opinion were incorrect. These two were in the senate and regarded each other as good friends. So much for putting loyalty, friendship before personal ambition.
83. Fed Up With Them All | 10.16.08
46. JennyO | 10.16.08
I don’t understand why McCain is so bothered by the idea of “spreading the wealth around”: 50% of Americans make less than $32,000, and a measly 5% make more than $250,000. The complete obliteration of the middle class is a huge problem, and it means that some of that wealth concentrated at the top _needs_ to be spread around.
***************************************************************************
Understand why our forefathers fought the Revolutionary War and you will understand the problem with “spreading the wealth around”. If you don’t care to educate yourself, then YOU are what’s wrong with this country.
Maybe McCain referred to Joe the Plumber because the guy’s name is Joe and he’s a plumber. Duh.
84. terrie | 10.16.08
so if you dont taxes the people that makes 250,000 and above a year so who are they going to tax? HumHum! interesting.
85. Ron | 10.16.08
Joe the plumber makes less than $100k a year and he did do his homework Obama’s tax plan will double (that’s twice as much) the taxes for everyone making more than $42,000 per year. But the he will give back some of the excess that he collects as a rebate check. So during the year Joe’s tacxes double sort of like a forced savings plan except without interest of return of all capital.
86. CKU | 10.16.08
“Jeff Smith | 10.16.08
“Ayers, who once held a fundraiser for Obama early in his political career . . . ”… Ayers served on the that board with Obama AS WELL AS with several prominent conservatives. Have your reporters research and report on that. I won’t hold my breath.”
WHAT?
For being a teacher this isn’t a very intelligent statement, those other board members aren’t important… they AREN’T running for president of the United States of America…(does United seem sort of like an oxymoron?).
Anyway, I just thought that statemnet to be a tad idio-tic, comparing a school board to the presidency. I pitty your students.
Respectfully,
CKU~
87. Michelle | 10.16.08
“Spreading the wealth around.” A friend once told me a simple analogy that seems to explain the anger that many Americans feel when they hear a statement such as this. Imagine you go to dinner with a a group of various individuals from your community. You all enjoy what you prefer to eat for dinner and everyone orders a dish. When the bill comes YOU are told that you have to pay for the three people sitting across from you because you have a higher paying job. Think about being at a meal, and the waiter coming to tell you this is the case. Basic principle. Spreading the wealth around will only allow people who know they are having someone else foot their bill order more expensive dinners.
88. Erica - virginia | 10.16.08
McCain, who I believe is a decent man, appeared to be in panic mode and he was desperately grasping at straws…bringin up Ayers, Acorn, and requesting an apology for another senator’s remark…and then not letting it drop…all made him appear to be a tempermental child. It’s like the kid who is losing at checkers and suddenly points his finger at his opponent and accuses him of cheating. When he spoke of Sarah Palin’s experience, he highlighted her association with special needs children?! How does that, in any way, qualify her to be president of the Unites States? Maybe president of the PTA…but, please. I like McCain, but felt sorry for him last night. I was uncomfortable watching him behave this way…it’s like watching a live performance tank…it’s just plain awkward. I had to get up and walk out of the room it made me squirm so much. Sad that he had to reduce himself to those sorts of tactics. In all reality, I know he’s a better man (and politician) than this. I guess he saw his dream slipping away and just couldn’t handle it.
89. DrCat | 10.16.08
I’m currently in my third year of medical school. I have been looking at family practice very hard - it’s what I wanted to do when I applied to school. I watch so many of my classmates come in interested in primary care (which is severely under-served and will be in absolute crisis as baby boomers continue to age), come out $200,000 in debt, and say “I have to choose a specialty. How will I ever pay my loans back otherwise”. I couldn’t believe it, but I found myself just asking the same question. I’ll tell you what - I don’t know one single family practice doc making over $150,000/yr (let alone $250,000)… not so with Cardiology, etc. So now with Obama, I have an incentive again to choose family medicine, even if it is just to avoid a higher tax bracket. This and his other sound policies will have far-reaching implications. Obama addresses EVERY SINGLE ISSUE I find important. He does it with poise and clarity. Last night, McCain just reminded me of a playground bully or a “little yippy dog” or a two year old throwing a temper tantrum b/c he can’t have a cookie. McCain is out of touch with America. He continually lies, then when Obama explains thoroughly why he is incorrect, he pretends like Obama said nothing and continues on with his same blind talk. For me this vote is a no-brainer. Obama is well-educated, cool, focused, observant and in-touch with the rest of us. The only people I know who are voting for McCain are doing so out of fear. Fear is a tool of the Devil.
90. Alan | 10.16.08
Since when did sharing become a sin and avarice a moral virtue? And why does one comentator seem to think that the concept of sharing is so abstruse and impenetrable to the average intellect as to require an analogy?
91. Steve in St. Louis | 10.16.08
I don’t understand why the Republicans complain so much about collecting tax dollars, but don’t seem to mind spending 10 billion of them each month on an unnecessary war.
92. Da Truth | 10.16.08
—He is Tall, Elegant, Eloquent and so much “Style over Substance”.
Do we need a “Style over Substance” President !!!
Then again he was not so Tall, Elegant, Eloquent in the first half of the Demi-Dem primary. When the Liberal Media was ‘Fawning’ over Hillary he was Angry, Accusational, Stumbling over his Words, and Brushing chips off his Shoulders. When the Media switched it’s “Fawning Gaze” to Obama he seemed Taller and his ‘Style over Substance’ clicked more. Was that because he knew the Media and Hollywood had his back !! Many would say it is easy to look Tall, Elegant & Eloquent when you know all of your mistakes will be explained away, ignored or covered up (he once said he had visited all 57 states). Anyone could look competent under that scenario………..
If as president he is in tough, ‘behind the scenes’ negotiations will “Style over Substance” cut it then. Will the media be able to help him out of a tough jam then !!! How will they rescue, or cover up for him then !!! Will he be able to stand on his own two feet at that point………….
Do we Want; Do we Need a ‘Style over Substance’, MEDIA INDUCED PRESIDENT….. ……………… ……………
93. KIMBER | 10.16.08
Let’s call Joe the Plumber by his accurate name: Joe who’s real name is Sam the unlicensed plumber who doesn’t pay the taxes he actually owes. Yet another smarmy Republican attempt at populism stunt.
94. Unwit | 10.16.08
This morning, I decided to check “Joe Plumber’s” math. First of all, he’d have to NET MORE THAN $250K to pay higher taxes on any of it, and as Obama clearly explained last night, his tax raise would entail a rate shift from 36% to 39% — ONLY on the amount OVER $250K!
So say Joe improved his profit margin and went from netting $250K to $275K. That’s ten percent, a big jump for one year. Under the current 36% rate, he’d be paying $9K tax on that $25K. Under Obama’s plan, Joe would pay $9750 on that top $25K.
So, because he’s going to pay an extra $750 on twenty-five thousand dollars extra profit, Joe is not going to buy the business?
Is Joe claiming that the extra $750 tax bill is going to prevent him from getting credit?
Has Joe been working so constantly that he has somehow not heard that the stock market has crashed, banks are terrified to lend money even to each other, and so credit is already much, much harder to get and will be for who knows how long?
95. Peggy McGilligan | 10.16.08
I believe John McCain prevailed in the debate, but neither candidate addresses the fact that 40 percent of all Mexicans now live in the United States. The unprecedented migration is a key economic factor. Anyway, John McCain does have an actual record. Sarah Palin has a record as well. On the other hand, Barack Obama wants to disavow the things that he has done, take credit for the things that he has not done, and spins a vision of the future that just doesn’t square. Where could Mr. Obama have glommed on to such fuzzy thinking?
In January 2001, Bill Clinton pardoned Weather Underground Organization members Susan Rosenberg and Linda Evans, but he didn’t exactly advertise it. During the Vietnam War, while John McCain endured a North Vietnamese prison, a draft dodging “Slick Willie” also participated in “teach-ins,” in the Soviet Union. He didn’t shout that from the rooftops either. While we played by the rules, WUO founder William Ayers and others tinkered with explosives.
Good career move that: lucrative teaching positions, generous grants, and political pardons to name but a few perks that follow the still intact terrorists. When a candidate like Sarah Palin gets slammed for traditional values, and an unrepentant Bill Ayers gets lionized for crimes of violence, it makes me know how far we’ve slid as a nation. In 1995, Bill Clinton would declare himself the “education president,” yet never mentions what he did in that capacity. Russian saying: the fish rots from the head: http://theseedsof9-11.com
96. Zac in California | 10.16.08
Where would the candidates get their money from?
Well, it would seem that Obama will push for higher taxes for some of us, and then do the American thing and borrow a lot of it.
If McCain would cut taxes, but not cut services, **** have to borrow that much more to realistically pay for everything.
Our current president has grown our government quite a bit, with the help of the, let’s be honest now, extremely bipartisan legislature. Our national debt has also jumped to frightening new heights in this time, all because of simple math - when you spend more, you need more money to pay for it. All the GOP’s tax policies have done for us lately is the equivalent of taking out loans when one should be going to *work* instead.
No one likes paying taxes. But if you want to pay less of them, you’re going to have to cut funding for programs. Plain and simple.
97. Williamned | 10.16.08
It was more of the same…..and yes, Obama behaves presidential in spite of his lack providing useful information about his future plans.
And John tried to play Messiah for Joe the -not so poor-Pl., but one saw him thinking: “Sara With The Assassins, please help!”
And we all know what this deceptive dechristanized creature from the North was and still IS implying.
98. Steve Ellis | 10.16.08
Someone mentioned that Bush had a Democratic controlled congress. this is only true for the last TWO YEARS! So to blame the Dems for what we’re going through right now is like blaming a child for his fathers murderous ways.
The Congress and Senate before that was controlled by Repbulicans.
What I find interesting is that in all that time they had controlling the presidency, the congress and the senate,they didn’t go after abortion in a real way. IF they are so Pro Life, why didn’t they eliminate abortion?
I’ll tell you why.
REPUBLICANS NEVER WANT TO ELIMINATE ABORTION.
Because in every election they use it as a wedge issue to divide people into extreme camps and solidify their base.
KEEPING ABORTION ALIVE AND KICKING IS IN THE INTEREST OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY AS AN ELECTION TOOL. THEY WILL NEVER ELIMINATE IT.
PS. I wrote all of this
99. Vivifiant | 10.16.08
Not bad idea. Afterall, those taxes will help the gov’t provide jobs and services back to Joes and you. So the gov’t will stop borrowing from China (I doubt, they probably creeping to control us).
100. Rich Pizzo | 10.17.08
McCain had the nerve, or should we say, the lack of conscience or stupidity or both, to use neoCon tactics -described below. From the sound of his attacks on Obama you think he was trying to start another unnecessary war only this time against “terrorist” Obama rather than Saddam.. McCain is a despicable neoCon who uses neoCon tactics to further his agenda, then with stuning audacity, he falsely blames and accuses Obama of doing what HE is doing.
From the bottom of his graduating class McCaine, challanges a Harvard and Princeton STAR?… the difference is startling.
The following tactics when used by politicians, corporate leadership, and media -observable and measurable- identify the people we do not need in government or big business.
Any person who purposely uses misinformation, misrepresentation, distortion, exaggeration, prevarication, equivocation, ridicule, personal attacks, logical fallacy, treachery calumny and lies to manipulate and further their agenda is undeserving and should not be empowered in any way whatsoever..
McCain IS no maverick, thats a misrepresentation, a packaging.. he IS another neoCon, another BUSH….
Obama is the better man by far.
Because of his neoCon tactics I don’t Trust McCaine, no how no way.
101. Don in NC | 10.17.08
I strongly feel than rather to wage class warfare, we need to look at the candidate with the best plan to get America on track again. Once, we were a people who were hard workers, honest, and helpful to others. In the last several decades that has become ‘wimpy’ at best. Now, we claim to be winners if we have much more wealth and material things than we need. What happened to an honest day’s work for an honest day’s pay?
Let’s elect McCain because his policies are more closely aligned with those of the average working person. I think redistribution of wealth is a dangerous idea. McCain has also said he is strong favor of reforming the bloated government system as it is now. He is the change agent that we need now in 2008 and forward.
102. warren | 10.19.08
You know, as much as we blab around, it won’t change a thing.
Let the best man win.
Go McCain.
104. VOA | 10.19.08
The problem with Joe the Plumber is he was being disingenuous and partisan when he asked his question. The conservative media wants us to find sympathy for him and says everyone is missing the real point that small businesses will be trampled upon by Obama’s tax plan. However, they are missing the real point by not saying that less than 2% of small businesses would net $250K.
Joe does not plan to buy a business. Joe cannot even pay his taxes. Joe said his taxes are nobody’s business, but I pay my taxes, Joe, I expect you to do the same. In the end, the real point is that Joe, and I, would do better under Obama’s tax plan–so would the country.
The evidence for this is in the comments of Warren Buffet, an Obama supporter. Buffet shows that the very wealthy are paying far less in taxes than the middle class. He says that he, a billionaire investor, paid only 17.7% while his secratary paid 30+% in payroll taxes. He sees this as a major problem that has existed throughout the plutocratic reign of the Republican party. He is calling for change.
Joe needs that change, but due to a complicated matrix of misinformation and prejudices (not necessarily racial), and a lack of critical thinking prowess, Joe just doesn’t get it. Unfortunately, there are many Joes out there (Joe Six Pack comes to mind).
The other thing that the average Joe does not seem to care too much about is the trampling on of our Constitution. Bush and Cheney believe that the Congress’ job is to serve the president (Cheney said as much publically). This is dispicable. It violates the basic principle of a separtation of powers that the founders based our democratic-republic. Palin echoed this uninformed view in her debate with the other Joe–the Joe in the Know.
Obama is a Constitutional scholar who respects the work of the founders and will uphold the basic principles of our country’s founding. Nobody can deny his understanding of our governing document. On the other hand, I can call to question the Republican respect for it.
Save our Constitution, throw out the plutocrats: Vote Obama/Biden ‘08.
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1. Jeff Smith | 10.16.08
I am a teacher an have enjoyed being about to direct students to CSM as a good source for news and election coverage because I have found it to lack a liberal bias. However, false statements like “Ayers, who once held a fundraiser for Obama early in his political career . . . ” just make my students (and anyone else who reads enough) critical of CSM and lose faith in its value as a news source. Ayers held a coffee clutch/meet and greet; there was no fund raising. Ayers served on the that board with Obama AS WELL AS with several prominent conservatives. Have your reporters research and report on that. I won’t hold my breath.