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In this May 1 photo, President Barack Obama arrives for a ceremony in the East Room of the White House. Since the president agreed to speak at Notre Dame's commencement, more than 353,000 people have signed an online petition demanding the university take back the offer.

(Gerald Herbert/AP/File)

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Catholics astir over Obama’s speech at Notre Dame

Opposition to his appearance at Sunday's commencement puts new attention on Catholic sensibilities – and on the president's stance on abortion and stem-cell research.

By Mark Guarino  |  Correspondent/ May 15, 2009 edition

Correspondent Mark Guarino discusses reactions in and around the Notre Dame campus to news that President Obama will speak there at commencement.

Correspondent Mark Guarino


Landing the president of the United States as commencement speaker is like grabbing the brass ring on the graduation-day carousel – usually. But for the University of Notre Dame, President Obama’s scheduled appearance Sunday as commencement speaker has touched off a gargantuan flap among Roman Catholics, not only about his policies on abortion and embryonic stem-cell research, but also about the role religion should or should not play in political life.

For a president who has taken care to embrace religious inclusivity, the vehement objections among some Catholics to his appearance at Notre Dame in South Bend, Ind., would indicate that being included may not be enough to keep certain values voters in Mr. Obama’s column.

“He claims he tries to be inclusive, but that doesn’t extend to practicing Catholics,” says Susan Fani, director of communications at The Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights, calling the president “hostile to Catholic beliefs.” “Considering he has been in office for 100 days,” she adds, “we’re surprised at the pace that Catholic sensibilities have been offended repeatedly.”

A split among Catholics

The debate among Catholics over the president’s commencement role at the most high-profile Catholic university in the US has been heated, but it is, perhaps, not surprising. There is a well-documented political split between observant Catholics – those who attend services at least weekly – and Catholics who attend church less frequently, with the former tending to vote Republican and the latter up for grabs. In the last election, though, Obama won half the observant Catholics and more than two-thirds of less-observant worshippers.

“There’s been a lot of discussion in the community – apart from this flash point at Notre Dame – about how we engage people with different perspectives,” says the Rev. Donald Senior, president of Catholic Theological Union, a theology school in Chicago. “A lot of the Catholic community is conflicted” regarding Obama, says Father Senior, because his stance on issues like poverty and economic inequity parallels church teachings, while his support for abortion rights and embryonic stem-cell research does not.

He suggests that the church’s leaders today are grappling with how to present a public face of Catholicism in a way that resonates in a positive light rather than always appearing to be unyielding and “the church of no.”

“Maybe the church leadership is trying to say, how do we navigate this [era of hot-button issues]? It’s much more dicey now than it was 30, 40 years ago” when John Kennedy became the first Catholic president of the United States, he says.

Slippage among Catholic voters

There are signs that some Catholics, 54 percent of whom voted for Obama in November, are rethinking their views of the president. For instance, the share of Catholics who disapprove of the president’s performance is rising. Only 20 percent disapproved in February; lately that share has jumped to 45 percent, according to a poll released two weeks ago by the Pew Research Center’s Forum on Religion & Public Life.

That means a majority of Catholics still approve of Obama’s performance, but support among observant Catholics – those who attend services at least once a week – is fading. Sixty-three percent of that subset is disapproving, compared with 43 percent of Catholics who go to church less often.

The White House, on Tuesday, acknowledged the controversy over the Notre Dame commencement speech, but sought to play down the extent of the opposition.

“It appears as if the vast majority of students and the majority of Catholics are supportive of the invitation the president accepted,” said Robert Gibbs, White House press secretary. “I think there is one group organizing a boycott, and as best I can understand it, there are 23 groups that have formed in support of the president’s invitation.”

In a prepared statement, Notre Dame president John Jenkins said the university found Obama “an inspiring leader” who was being honored especially because he is “our first African-American president.” “Racial prejudice has been a deep wound in America, and Mr. Obama has been a healer,” the Rev. Mr. Jenkins said. “Of course, this does not mean we support all of his positions.”

Abortion as the ‘line in the sand’ issue

Though Catholics in the US are split over their acceptance of abortion, the Catholic Church is definitive in its opposition. That position has always been “in the architecture of Catholic teaching,” but only in the past quarter-century has the church’s public identity been so closely linked to its abortion stance, says Richard Rosengarten, dean of the University of Chicago Divinity School. The war in Iraq and capital punishment also created opportunities for church leaders to raise their voices, but they chose abortion as the “line in the sand” issue, he says.

“One of the struggles that the bishops have today is that the political discourse is so intensified, so that any time the church is placed next to a political issue, the challenge is to figure out whether to engage and, secondly, how. It’s very, very difficult,” says Mr. Rosengarten, who is Catholic. “I think the bishops are saying, ‘We can tolerate a certain element of ambiguity about capital punishment and Iraq, but where we really have to make the nonnegotiable is [abortion].’ ”

Other beefs

The Notre Dame controversy is creating opportunities for Catholic advocacy groups to outline a number of disagreements with the president and Democratic lawmakers.

One is an antihate-crime bill, sponsored by Sens. Edward Kennedy (D) of Massachusetts and Patrick Leahy (D) of Vermont, that some Catholics say will result in a priest being prosecuted if someone commits a hate crime as a consequence of a church teaching against, for instance, homosexuality.

Another was Obama’s pledge in early March to “make scientific decisions based on facts, not ideology” regarding stem-cell research. That “was taken as special slap to religious groups,” says Richard Doerflinger, associate director of the US Bishops’ Secretariat for Pro-Life Activities.

“I do think some Catholics who voted for the president thinking he wasn’t really going to take that strong a stand against the church on life issues, some of those people have reasons to be disappointed,” says Mr. Doerflinger. “We have to see what more is coming.”

Some Catholics objected, too, when they learned that certain religious iconography was removed from the backdrop during Obama’s speech in April at Georgetown University in Washington, also a Catholic university.

Kinship with evangelicals

As Catholic groups raise concerns, they are finding an unlikely ally: Protestant evangelicals.

“The core values of the Catholic church are our core values,” says evangelical leader Lou Engle, who is considering showing up at Notre Dame on Sunday in support of Catholic protesters. “It’s amazing how a battle can bring together strange bedfellows.”

Whether Catholics will splinter further over politics remains to be seen. But Democrats risk losing at least some of the gains of the last election.

The Catholic League’s Ms. Fani says because Obama’s track record with Catholic leaders has started off on such shaky footing, “they’re not going along with the Obama administration.”

She adds: “And I don’t think that’s good for the Democratic Party.”

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Comments

1. dom youngross | 05.15.09

How do Catholics feel about sending more troops into the hellhole of Afghanistan?

“Troop levels are now at 38,000, a record, and are set to hit about 68,000 by late 2009.”

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124234734984621969.html

Any pro-life Catholic who isn’t livid about Iraq, Afghanistan, and Pakistan is a stinking hypocrite.

2. William M Tracy II | 05.15.09

I believe that all people should respect the President. If the students wish to protest, then they should receive their degrees in the mail and not take part in the graduation.

You do not have to agree with everything the president belives. BUT you should respect the President and the office. A lot of great AMERICANS have
lost their lives in wars to give the this group of stupid students the right to protest.

Not everyone was born with a SILVER SPOON in their mouths. The rest of us had to work for our degrees, and some had to work 40 plus hours a week and attend college at night to complete what this group seems to have been handed to them.

Protest all you want..BUT thank GOD that you live in a country that allows you to protest, and not go to jail or be shot.

3. james Mc Williams | 05.15.09

I hope the students at Notre Dame are capable of listening to different points of view and determing for themselves what makes sense . I suspect years from now they will remember that the President of the United States delivered their commencement speech and not the speeches of those who would like to censor speech they disagree with .

4. Stephanie Woerfel | 05.15.09

George Bush gave the commencement address at Notre Dame, after lying about the war in Iraq and killing hundreds of civilians where was the moral outrage then?

5. Think Again | 05.15.09

Like an Italian lady who when asked how she reconciled her faith with her need for contraceptives said about the Pope:

He don’t play the game, so he don’t make the rules.

6. Melissa | 05.15.09

President Obama is delivering on one of his campaign platforms: creating unity!

7. David K. McClurkin | 05.15.09

Let me just suggest that any who wish to consider the underlying issue about the role of universities in advancing mankind, peruse the recent article by a member of the Notre Dame Trustees. It includes this statement:

“There are few, if any, policies on which our society can find total agreement. But we advance as a society and as a nation when we concentrate on the principles on which we are united, and not those that divide us. It is one of the responsibilities of our universities to illuminate the values we share and to define those issues we must resolve as we go forward.”

http://tinyurl.com/pjng6n

8. JP in Texas | 05.15.09

Hmmmm lets pop that dvd “Being David Axlerod ” in.Looks as though Davy boy did’nt plan for this scenario.Ticked off ,motivated students mostly Catholic @ the pre eminent Catholic University in the Western hemisphere debating the issue of our time -the rights of the voiceless-the unborn versus the power of the state to sanction abortion as a means of birth control as well as harvesting human stem cells.The Catholic world/communities/families /voters are not the only opponents .The are joined by Orthodox Jews ,Muslim Imams,Protestants & moral people everywhere.Mr.Puppet ,cut your strings and get on the right side of things for once!

9. GtG | 05.16.09

Mr. Tracy: People who have been protesting the appearance at Notre Dame HAVE been arrested for exercising their rights…check the website catholic.org

10. BW in Louisiana | 05.16.09

Mr. Obama said during his campaign that he did not want his daughter to be punished with a baby for having made a mistake. He breezed through the idea of his daughter getting rid of the “problem” like someone would kick off a shoe and then without one second of pause moved into the next point of his speech. I was taken back by his speech and thought that the next day it would be headline news, but… nothing, till now. Hopefully Mr. Obama will realize people do not take abortion lightly. The ultimate child abuse, to your own child and their baby, would it be his daughter’s decision or his to terminate the child?

11. Carolyn | 05.16.09

Educators & Parents

There is a time to stand for what you hold true and there is a time to radically stand for what you hold true. There is no time not to stand for what you hold true. There is no other time.

Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego would not have survived the fiery furnace except for their radical stand. The King could not help them.

The world asks: Are you Roman Catholic or wantabe Roman Catholic? How have you trained up your child?

12. David K. McClurkin | 05.16.09

University of Notre Dame President Fr. John Jenkins sent a letter dated May 11 to all Notre Dame graduates that is reported on in this link. Obama will be the ninth president to receive a degree from Notre Dame. This portion prompts me to share it with readers:

“It has never been a political statement or an endorsement of policy,” Jenkins said of the honorary degrees. “It is the University’s expression of respect for the leader of the nation and the Office of the President. In the Catholic tradition, our first allegiance is to God in Christ, yet we are called to respect, participate in, and contribute to the wider society.

“As St. Peter wrote (I Pt. 2:17), we should honor the leader who upholds the secular order,” Jenkins wrote.

http://tinyurl.com/pkq5o4

13. Brian B. | 05.16.09

I am a baptised and confirmed Anglican Christian. However, I just don’t understand what’s going on up there at Notre Dame. It seems that once Obama got elected the radical right wing fringe elements of the Republican party went haywire under the false assumption that the new President was going to destroy American family values. It seems to me that being intollerant of another point of view, in a country that was founded to permit differing points of view and religious expression, is myopic and akin to the rehashing of an inquisition movement seeking to establish orthodox teaching. Not to be belittling, but I find it odd that the Catholic fundamentalists protesting the Presidents commencement speech are allying with the protestant evangelicals. This is akin to Osama Bin Laden allying himself with Shia Muslims to overthrow the Saudi monarchy. This would never happen in that realm. If it’s orthodox purity that the Catholics want then why sell yourself out on the holy mission of religious persecution and inquisition of the President of the United States.

14. Manuel | 05.16.09

BW, that comment you said Obama is sickening, I just looked it up, I am surprised that it did nit get major airwaves. So, so sad that he would feel a child is a problem like that, an insult to single mothers everywhere.

15. James K. Riley | 05.16.09

Many who have attended secular American colleges and universities are familiar with the Newman Centers which serve as oasis or preserves for individual students to meet and renew, or at least attempt to renew, their connections, however tenuous, with the Roman Catholic religion. Over years, Newman Centers have served an essential and important function in providing a religious respite for students, and college staff, to go to for open debate and discussion, if not outright spiritual rehabilitation.

The Cardinal Newman Society which is leading the anti-Barack Obama Notre Dame commencement movement is neither directly nor indirectly affiliated with the myriad Newman Centers encountered around the country. It is, instead, a horse of a distinctly different color. In fact, since Notre Dame University is a Catholic University, it is unlikely that it would have a Newman Center although one could argue that the entire university serves as one giant Newman Center for its students. And, examining the individuals who populate the governing body and officer-ships of the Cardinal Newman Society, one must wonder whether there are any students, from either Notre Dame or any other school, directly involved in the operating engine of the Cardinal Newman Society.

Every indication is that the individuals providing leadership in the Cardinal Newman Society are is an accumulation of mature adults espousing conservative Roman Catholic concepts in quite a dogmatic and fundamentalist manner—not college aged students working within a Newman Center as we commonly know such entities. We note that this very same Cardinal Newman Society appears to be regularly engaged in attacks upon Roman Catholic colleges and universities who have the temerity to invite graduation speakers whose expressed thoughts or beliefs are not on “all fours” with those of the Cardinal Newman Society. In addition, this very same Cardinal Newman Society has issued a list of 18 faculty members of Catholic colleges and universities who are deserving of immediate termination for espousal of views which somehow are totally unacceptable to the Cardinal Newman Society and Roman Catholicism in general.

When we utilize the word “fundamentalist”, we ascribe to the definition set forth by the Fundamentalist Project, which author and radio commentator Krista Tippett refers to in her book, Speaking of Faith, i.e. an “… ingathering of people into their separatenesses and overagainstnesses to protect their pride and power and place from others who are doing the same thing”.

When one closely examines the information published by the Cardinal Newman Society concerning the leadership of that organization, one will be hard pressed, and perhaps unsuccessful, in any attempt to locate or identify any composite group of individuals with direct connections to the University of Notre Dame. We mention this fact only to emphasize that the effort to forestall President Barack Obama’s appearance at the Notre Dame commencement, and his receipt of an Honorary Degree, is not a student groundswell but instead is being engineered by an outside, mature group of Roman Catholic religious conservatives.

In the end, we do not wish to silence the Cardinal Newman Society, although they might seek to silence this comment and to silence or prevent the well deserved and appropriate appearance of a remarkable individual who, in the tradition of the University of Notre Dame, has earned the Honorary Degree to be presented to him at the forthcoming commencement and the corresponding right to speak to all of those gathered on that wonderful day, And, to analogize the argument of those religious conservatives, including Kenneth Starr, who argued for religious prayer at public schools commencements in the Supreme Court case of Lee v. Weismann, if you don’t like a particular speaker or the message of that speaker at a non-governmental, non-public school’s commencement ceremonies, you can always remain at home—no one said that any particular individual has to attend Notre Dame’s 2009 graduation; the University only has stated that one individual is absolutely entitled to attend and to speak, United States President Barack Obama, and rightfully so.

16. richard potter | 05.16.09

The presidents campaign rheotric regarding abortion, birth control, and stem-cell research remains the same today. Many Catholic, and Protestant did not want to believe the president would continue to take positions counter these important faith issues. Was anyone listening?

17. rman | 05.16.09

Sounds like the same kind of debates happening in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan and Iran. We are telling the rest of the world to wake up and modernize their views on religion - to separate church and state and to embrace secularism.
Meanwhile we are stuck with the flat earth and heliocentric centric views of our religious friends. What hypocrisy. Sadly we may be heading for a new dark age in the west.

18. Mama | 05.16.09

Intellectual discussion is great. Respecting the leaders is great. Tolerating others peculiarities is great. I do not agree with stem cell research, or abortion, as a matter of my Christian understanding. However, this I know from long experience, girls and women are individuals. Some use multiple abortions to protect their alleycat lifestyles. And pay for it in their later years. Some have found themselves the victims of crime against them. Some are very sensitive, and never get over giving up a baby to either abortion or adoption, emotionally.
If a girl is too young to care for a baby, let her decide after the birth, if there is enough family support and love to keep it. Sometimes the fact of the baby in your arms wipes away all the arguments.If the woman is older, she can decide, also after the birth, how to order her life and the child’s.
There is too much of the throwaway mentality in this era.
As a mom of five, there is none that I would return for a refund. They are each one individual and precious. More love and generosity is needed. Economically, yes, you can afford the new addition.

19. Holly McLachlan | 05.16.09

Why did you choose to quote Susan Fani, director of communications at The Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights, twice, without describing the nature of her organization? The Catholic League is a notoriously ultra-Rightist organization that attends to church doctrine only when it coincides with their agenda. Why didn’t you include quotes from Roman Catholic activists who focus on the full spectrum of Church teachings….. rather than provide a forum for these grandstanding extremists?
Donohue’s freakish organization does not speak for most Roman Catholics and does not speak for the Church as a whole.

20. Jacob | 05.16.09

Bush rubbed his ideology in everyone’s faces everywhere he went, compared to Obama who at least keeps his political beliefs under wraps when the situation calls for it….so why it that conservatives are so much more eager to take up arms against Obama than liberals were to against Bush?

21. Lys | 05.17.09

President Obama will be respected as far as he is a man/leader of integrity. He is for sure a very inspirational figure among many people in America and beyond; but Obama should also be careful not promote or/and support a group of people whose ideology aims at silencing and intimidating others only because they do not share the same view points. My points is if Obama truly believes that getting rid of unborn baby (in case one of his daugthers happened to be pregnant) means to support a so-called freedom of choice, he totally misses the point. I wonder what the mother of these two precious girls have to say about this?! Anyway I am an African young lady who had had three abortions not by choice because no choice was offered me. I wish someone would have told me of the consequences; I wish someone would have offered to adopt my babies instead. This is a choice which is being denied many young girls in America. I challenge the President and his friends the ACLU to offer this choice to the women they think they are fighting for. Oh one more thing, please keep your baby genocide to America, keep ACLU away from Africa, Africa has suffered enough genocide!

22. jreddoch | 05.17.09

This is the president of the United States. How can you not treat this as an honor? Will Catholics agree completely with any president. Bush AND Obama support the death penalty, which is also very much against Catholic teaching. Why have we heard nothing on that?

Listen, my college commencement speaker was some boring gasbag whose name I can’t remember who spoke for more than an hour on the history of research in my admittedly obscure field. I would have loved to have a president, ANY president as a speaker.

Stop whining and show some respect to the office of President Of The United States.

23. Sue | 05.17.09

Abortion has been off the public radar screen for awhile. In most times, the President has no direct say over the issue. He can make speeches, but that’s about it. The only way a President can influence the legality of abortion is through a Supreme Court appointment. President Obama has the opportunity to make a Supreme Court appointment now. Anti-abortion activists may be using this moment of the President’s speech at Notre Dame to try to exert some influence over the choice of justices. That isn’t going to work. President Obama is not going to choose a Supreme Court justice who will overturn the ruling in Roe v. Wade.

24. Wm. F. | 05.17.09

Reading some of these posts by the pro abortion “rights” , I am taken aback by the tone. A mocking and rather cynical view of life is displayed.When and how did their souls begin to die?Sad.

25. David Hofmeister | 05.17.09

With respect, as a long time reader of the Monitor, I am surprised that reader response comments one and two are published. They have little to do with the article on this page. Hateful speech will occur, but the stinking hypocrite comment makes little sense relative to its point of reference. Why did comments about wars in Afghanistan and Iraq feed into this article? The second comment simply presents that abortion opponents should limit 1st Amendment rights. The literal and inferential comprehension one might gather from the article should be kept in mind as the moderator determines what to publish or not publish. I read the Monitor for its intelligent reporting. Please adhere to your standards. I think it is important to do so.

26. Greg Macfarlane | 05.17.09

I feel I’m in a unique position, as I protested when Dick Cheney came and spoke at my university’s (Brigham Young) commencement two years ago. But my reasons for doing it were somewhat different.

I think the focus should be on who extended and who accepted the invitation for President Obama to speak. Is the White House seeking to extend its base by reaching out to Catholic conservatives at their most valued university? Or did the University seek to honor the man who leads this country and swears to protect all its citizens?

In BYU’s case, it was pretty clear that the White House wanted Cheney to speak because Provo is the one city in the nation that would not have booed him off the stage, and it’s important to at least look like you’re trying to support the graduates every year. But there are extremely few schools in the country that would not fall over each other trying to land an Obama venue, so if he was looking for somewhere he would be liked, he could have gone somewhere else.

No, Obama is really seeking to build real consensus by speaking on “enemy ground.” Now, to see if he can accomplish the religious rout in his term by also speaking at Oral Roberts, Texas Christian, and my own Brigham Young.

27. Hope2008 | 05.17.09

Abortion Rocks!Yes we can!

28. jpecci | 05.17.09

I’m not astir. I am Catholic. I dont know any fellow Catholics who are “astir” over President Obama speaking at Notre Dame. What does get me astir is the media sensationalism afforded to a handful of radical right-wingers who claim to represent Catholicism. Where the **** was the Catholic League (a bunch of phonies) when Bush spoke at Notre Dame

29. Jim McCrea | 05.17.09

To quote the pre-eminent Catholic scholar and convert, John Henry Newman:

“The primary purpose of a University is intellectual and pedagogical, not moral or religious.

“The view taken of a University in these Discourses is the following. — That it is a place of teaching universal knowledge. This implies that its object is, on the one hand, intellectual, not moral; and, on the other, that it is the diffusion and extension of knowledge rather than the advancement. If its object were scientific and philosophical discovery, I do not see why a University should have students; if religious training, I do not see how it can be the seat of literature and science.”

From the “Preface,” The Idea of a University

30. Shaunda Eck | 05.17.09

I disagree with an earlier comment, that President Obama deserves the honorary law degree “in the tradtion” of Notre Dame University. President Obama may be very deserving of an honorary law degree from any number of secular schools, however, his political stance and voting record negate him deserving the honor of being bestowed with such from a true catholic perspective. For the University of Notre Dame to call itself a catholic university and to turn around and offer an “honorary degree” to a man whose views on abortion are so grossly beyond moderate is physically sickening.

Let me clarify that if we were honoring the president from Penn State University or the University of Virginia or any other state funded school, this would be a non-issue. The man may be very deserving of such an honor from a secular perspective. This has been a political game being played by Obama since he announced he would be speaking at Notre Dame. I am sad to say it is now clear it is a political and financial game for the University of Notre Dame as well.

Abortion is the issue because that is what the president wanted it to be. Do not tell me, as intelligent as the man is, that he did not know what he was doing when he invited himself to the univeristy. Do not tell me one of the brightest intellectual minds in the world was not aware of the impact this would have. He choose this battle for a political reason and purpose. That is what the protests are about. They are not protesting the first African American President. They are not protesting him being deserving of the presidency.

No matter what your politcal or religious affliation is, abortion is a human issue. It is a human rights issue. It is not just a catholic issue. The right to life or the right to choose should not be a game we allow our government to use to divide us and keep themselves in power. Both political parties are feeding off of this issue because we have allowed them to do so. We the people are to blame for this atrocity.

If you were any sort of human being you would not be out there shouting against the atrocities of war, poverty, violence,murder, and prejudice while turning a deaf ear to the most helpless and innocent group of human beings. If you were any sort of human being you would not be placing the rights of animals and trees over the rights of human lives. If you were any sort of human being you WOULD be sickened by the greatest number of atrocities committed against your own people. There is no honor in Obama’s political stand on abortion from a human perspective. There is no honor in him using a catholic university as a platform for his political game. Thank God we do still have the right to speak out and voice our beliefs and opinions. How long do you really believe He will allow us to retain these rights if we continue to committ atrocities against innocent helpless human beings?

31. J. Rupe-Boyd | 05.17.09

Many of the people who say they are supporters of the right to life do not condemn the death penalty. The catholic church itself is not consistent in that it rarely mentions the death penalty when discussing right to life issues. It seems to me that killing is killing and we shouldn’t pick and chose what life is important before the eyes of God. I find it ironic that George W. Bush was elected as a right to life president when as governor of Texas he supported executions.

32. Chops | 05.18.09

BW Louisiana:
“The ultimate child abuse, to your own child and their baby, would it be his daughter’s decision or his to terminate the child?”

I would think the ultimate child abuse would be the hundreds if not thousands of molestations by priests that the Catholic church covered up for so many years. Hypocrite.

33. Ben | 05.18.09

Found this article particularly interesting. A former member of the ND committee to recommend honorary degrees notes the selection of a Jewish scholar. He ponders:
“How can it be ok to award an honorary degree to a person who does not recognize the divinity of Christ, but not ok to award one to someone who might have a different conception about conception?”

34. HeartLessRomantic | 05.18.09

Too bad His mother did’nt have that”right”.

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